Are you religious?

[NJS 4355]

We are an animal, an incredibly complex and varied animal, but an animal none-the-less. What seems to work in Nature is survival of the fittest (I'm only using that term because of it's ease), surely if Man were to achieve excellence we should follow the same model?

 

I think that's a misconception - not that we're animals but that what you refer to as survival of the fittest which is actually survival of those who are the best at reproducing.

 

Primates of which we are one are social animals - humanity has thrived through building communities. Of course conflict can then arise between communities but the basic need to want to belong is something we shouldn't knock. That can work wrongly in the sense of nationalism or even in religious gang forming but I think ideally I'd like to see our community forming instinct to be globalised and not just for trade.

 

I think on that score however, Sci-Fi probably has it right - it will take either the conquest of space or contact with other life to bring about a true worldwide community.

[Guest alex]

Also, if there is a God, I'd love for him to sit down and explain Newcastle United Football Club to me.... tbh

That's surely manifest, undeniable proof that He doesn't exist

I know you're jesting but it sort of brings up another thing. It bothers me that so many people worry about something that doesn't either exist or that they have no control over. It would be a much better world if people concentrated on stuff they can actually influence and improve the world / make it a more pleasant place. Who was it said people should worship people?

 

Come join the Humanist revolution. First we'll kill the Jews, then the Muslims, then the Pope, and then we'll force the remaining world to convert to Humanism, build massive "places of worship" to reaffirm our love of Humanism, set out a strict code that all Humanists must follow or they'll be screwed at the end, and make sure that large amounts of money are donated to some sort of Central Humanist building which obviously needs a leader, who doesn't really need to follow the underlying Humanist values.... and then the world will be a much better pla......... oh crap its happened again!!

I don't even know what a humanist really is tbh. I don't see why you need a name for a lack of something though. You do touch upon something though, the inherent flaws in human nature. But then again, religion is man made anyway.

[Dr Kenneth Noisewater 0]

Also, if there is a God, I'd love for him to sit down and explain Newcastle United Football Club to me.... tbh

That's surely manifest, undeniable proof that He doesn't exist

I know you're jesting but it sort of brings up another thing. It bothers me that so many people worry about something that doesn't either exist or that they have no control over. It would be a much better world if people concentrated on stuff they can actually influence and improve the world / make it a more pleasant place. Who was it said people should worship people?

 

Come join the Humanist revolution. First we'll kill the Jews, then the Muslims, then the Pope, and then we'll force the remaining world to convert to Humanism, build massive "places of worship" to reaffirm our love of Humanism, set out a strict code that all Humanists must follow or they'll be screwed at the end, and make sure that large amounts of money are donated to some sort of Central Humanist building which obviously needs a leader, who doesn't really need to follow the underlying Humanist values.... and then the world will be a much better pla......... oh crap its happened again!!

I don't even know what a humanist really is tbh. I don't see why you need a name for a lack of something though. You do touch upon something though, the inherent flaws in human nature. But then again, religion is man made anyway.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanism

[Neville Neville Neville 0]

This is the bit that resonates with me

 

Humanism is a democratic and ethical life stance, which affirms that human beings have the right and responsibility to give meaning and shape to their own lives. It stands for the building of a more humane society through an ethic based on human and other natural values in the spirit of reason and free inquiry through human capabilities. It is not theistic, and it does not accept supernatural views of reality.

 

But it is a bit sad that this (or something similar) isn't seen as the norm

[Guest alex]

Also, if there is a God, I'd love for him to sit down and explain Newcastle United Football Club to me.... tbh

That's surely manifest, undeniable proof that He doesn't exist

I know you're jesting but it sort of brings up another thing. It bothers me that so many people worry about something that doesn't either exist or that they have no control over. It would be a much better world if people concentrated on stuff they can actually influence and improve the world / make it a more pleasant place. Who was it said people should worship people?

 

Come join the Humanist revolution. First we'll kill the Jews, then the Muslims, then the Pope, and then we'll force the remaining world to convert to Humanism, build massive "places of worship" to reaffirm our love of Humanism, set out a strict code that all Humanists must follow or they'll be screwed at the end, and make sure that large amounts of money are donated to some sort of Central Humanist building which obviously needs a leader, who doesn't really need to follow the underlying Humanist values.... and then the world will be a much better pla......... oh crap its happened again!!

I don't even know what a humanist really is tbh. I don't see why you need a name for a lack of something though. You do touch upon something though, the inherent flaws in human nature. But then again, religion is man made anyway.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanism

Cheers.

I meant I don't know what is even when I look at their beliefs. There 'beliefs' are rather ethereal. It's almost as much guff as religion.

[Craig 6670]

My belief borders between atheism and agnosticism if that's at all possible.

Same.

 

And here...

 

I also think it's a subject that needs approaching with care.

[Dr Kenneth Noisewater 0]

Also, if there is a God, I'd love for him to sit down and explain Newcastle United Football Club to me.... tbh

That's surely manifest, undeniable proof that He doesn't exist

I know you're jesting but it sort of brings up another thing. It bothers me that so many people worry about something that doesn't either exist or that they have no control over. It would be a much better world if people concentrated on stuff they can actually influence and improve the world / make it a more pleasant place. Who was it said people should worship people?

 

Come join the Humanist revolution. First we'll kill the Jews, then the Muslims, then the Pope, and then we'll force the remaining world to convert to Humanism, build massive "places of worship" to reaffirm our love of Humanism, set out a strict code that all Humanists must follow or they'll be screwed at the end, and make sure that large amounts of money are donated to some sort of Central Humanist building which obviously needs a leader, who doesn't really need to follow the underlying Humanist values.... and then the world will be a much better pla......... oh crap its happened again!!

I don't even know what a humanist really is tbh. I don't see why you need a name for a lack of something though. You do touch upon something though, the inherent flaws in human nature. But then again, religion is man made anyway.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanism

Cheers.

I meant I don't know what is even when I look at their beliefs. There 'beliefs' are rather ethereal. It's almost as much guff as religion.

I'd never heard of it until last spring when I went to a Humanist funeral. Instead of hymns and prayers they played a few of the departed's favourite songs and the family read out poetry or told stories about them. It was a lot less depressing than a normal funeral.

[Guest alex]

Also, if there is a God, I'd love for him to sit down and explain Newcastle United Football Club to me.... tbh

That's surely manifest, undeniable proof that He doesn't exist

I know you're jesting but it sort of brings up another thing. It bothers me that so many people worry about something that doesn't either exist or that they have no control over. It would be a much better world if people concentrated on stuff they can actually influence and improve the world / make it a more pleasant place. Who was it said people should worship people?

 

Come join the Humanist revolution. First we'll kill the Jews, then the Muslims, then the Pope, and then we'll force the remaining world to convert to Humanism, build massive "places of worship" to reaffirm our love of Humanism, set out a strict code that all Humanists must follow or they'll be screwed at the end, and make sure that large amounts of money are donated to some sort of Central Humanist building which obviously needs a leader, who doesn't really need to follow the underlying Humanist values.... and then the world will be a much better pla......... oh crap its happened again!!

I don't even know what a humanist really is tbh. I don't see why you need a name for a lack of something though. You do touch upon something though, the inherent flaws in human nature. But then again, religion is man made anyway.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanism

Cheers.

I meant I don't know what is even when I look at their beliefs. There 'beliefs' are rather ethereal. It's almost as much guff as religion.

I'd never heard of it until last spring when I went to a Humanist funeral. Instead of hymns and prayers they played a few of the departed's favourite songs and the family read out poetry or told stories about them. It was a lot less depressing than a normal funeral.

I've been to one as well. It's just not bothering having a vicar or whatever though. Which is what I want. I don't get 'Humanism' in itself as an organised movement. It means absolutely nothing to me. It's just a name for everything which isn't religious, superstitious etc. Which is about as non-descript as you can get if you think about it.

[Neville Neville Neville 0]

not really related, but not worth its own topic

anyone see this?

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/article2229774.ece

bloody ridiculous

[Park Life 71]

I thought Germany rearming itself and invading Poland was the main cause of the war?

 

Which is why nothing happened for about 6 months.

The invasion of Poland was the final straw that drew us into the war. The main cause of Germany basically spoiling for a fight was the rise of Nazism which in turn was borne out of the economic situation which came about because the terms of the Treaty of Versailles were so harsh on Germany and basically bankrupt the country. The Great Depression following the Wall St. Crash exacerbated the situation.

 

It was mainly about asset grabs, the fact that the Germans didn't have an empire. Financial pressure in Europe and the collision of post-empire capitalism. Banks discovered a new industry - war loans. I've squeezed it down as far as is sensible.

[Park Life 71]

Brought up a Catholic.

 

Been in a Catholic monastery for 6 months when younger.

 

Marxist - Leninist phase

 

Sartre phase

 

Nietschean phase

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Now Buddhist of sorts.

Been to Tibet and all that.

 

 

I do get turned on by girls who have mad religious leanings.

[Ketsbaia 0]

They're always the dirtiest ones, Parkster.

 

In my experience once you get the Burka off they're up for owt.

[Park Life 71]

They're always the dirtiest ones, Parkster.

 

In my experience once you get the Burka off they're up for owt.

[tooner 243]

Christened Church of England, but not remotely religious, I believe in science.

 

Don't recall the last time I was in a church. Last wedding I went to was a registry office do and the last funeral was a non-religious humanist ceremony at a crem.

I do think that most of the wars and conflicts of the last century have been caused at least in part by religion.

I don't think that bears close analysis tbh. WWI/II, Korea, Vietnam, the Gulf War etc?

Didn't persecution of the jews play a part in WW2 then?

It wasn't a cause of the conflict.

 

 

agreed it was the persecution of everyone....those naziis were equal opportunity persecutors

That wasn't a cause of the war either. Unless you class invasion of other countires as persecution. Which I suppose it is. No one entered the war to help people being persecuted in Germany though, as far as I know.

 

Semantics really, while you are pointing out the actual events which caused the second world war, I read DKN's post as pointing out the persecution of the jews based on their religion by the nazis.......who (by whatever actual means) started the war......to which I was trying to point out that they persecuted everyone that didn't accept the party line......hmmmm reminds me of W's state of the union address post 9/11

It didn't though. Which is my point.

 

oh rly? if the nazis didn't start the war....who did?

[Guest alex]

Christened Church of England, but not remotely religious, I believe in science.

 

Don't recall the last time I was in a church. Last wedding I went to was a registry office do and the last funeral was a non-religious humanist ceremony at a crem.

I do think that most of the wars and conflicts of the last century have been caused at least in part by religion.

I don't think that bears close analysis tbh. WWI/II, Korea, Vietnam, the Gulf War etc?

Didn't persecution of the jews play a part in WW2 then?

It wasn't a cause of the conflict.

 

 

agreed it was the persecution of everyone....those naziis were equal opportunity persecutors

That wasn't a cause of the war either. Unless you class invasion of other countires as persecution. Which I suppose it is. No one entered the war to help people being persecuted in Germany though, as far as I know.

 

Semantics really, while you are pointing out the actual events which caused the second world war, I read DKN's post as pointing out the persecution of the jews based on their religion by the nazis.......who (by whatever actual means) started the war......to which I was trying to point out that they persecuted everyone that didn't accept the party line......hmmmm reminds me of W's state of the union address post 9/11

It didn't though. Which is my point.

 

oh rly? if the nazis didn't start the war....who did?

Sorry, I thought you meant they started the war for / it was caused by religious reasons. If you didn't mean that I don't get the relevance.

Edited February 12, 2009 by alex

[Ayatollah Hermione 13762]

I thought Germany rearming itself and invading Poland was the main cause of the war?

 

Which is why nothing happened for about 6 months.

The invasion of Poland was the final straw that drew us into the war. The main cause of Germany basically spoiling for a fight was the rise of Nazism which in turn was borne out of the economic situation which came about because the terms of the Treaty of Versailles were so harsh on Germany and basically bankrupt the country. The Great Depression following the Wall St. Crash exacerbated the situation.

 

It was mainly about asset grabs, the fact that the Germans didn't have an empire. Financial pressure in Europe and the collision of post-empire capitalism. Banks discovered a new industry - war loans. I've squeezed it down as far as is sensible.

 

Pretty much but Hitler's expansion was based in a belief that Germany were destined to rule over Europe as much as anything else. I think early expansion was about gaining industry/lebensraum and when he realised that Chamberlain and the rest of Europe would have probably stepped aside unless he'd pissed on the Cliffs of Dover, he took the opportunity to expand, based on the general uselessness of Europe up to that point. Having said that, the First World War was much more grounded in the protection and gaining of colonies than the Second. WWII, at its core, was based around ideological differences rather than religion.

[Dr Kenneth Noisewater 0]

Muslim, Dont pray, Dont go to mosque.

Do you drink alcohol Bawan?

[SloopJohn 0]

Basically, if there is a God, why does he allow such suffering to happen? He's either helpless or malevolent. Or doesn't exist. I tend to go with the latter.

 

have you read any theology books?

[Guest alex]

Basically, if there is a God, why does he allow such suffering to happen? He's either helpless or malevolent. Or doesn't exist. I tend to go with the latter.

 

have you read any theology books?

No.

[SloopJohn 0]

why not?

[Guest alex]

Surely that's a philosophical question.

[Magma 0]

Catholic.

[SloopJohn 0]

do you think that Christians suffer like all humans? I'm guessing you do. So aren't you curious how they still believe in God despite this?

[Guest alex]

do you think that Christians suffer like all humans? I'm guessing you do. So aren't you curious how they still believe in God despite this?

Sorry, that last answer was a ref to the corny old joke. The question on a philosopy paper was: "Why?" Top marks went to the student who answered "Why not?"

 

In response to your question though, no - not really.

[SloopJohn 0]

so you have a resolute opinion on God's existence without any understanding of the intellectual material that guides faith?