Happy Face 29 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 Good players get no grief, regardless of creed or colour. Mostly, in most cases it is the case. However, the point remains. Black players on Tyneside have more work to do to win fans over than White ones. Black players get still get tacit abuse which we seem to accept e.g. bling bastard. White ones dont. why? Acceptable? 48733[/snapback] Whey that's cos you couldn't rightly describe any of our white players as bling! I never heard about Stephen Carr asking for the coach to be stopped so he could go and get his diamond earrings and I never saw Andy O'Brien out on the tiles, let alone swanking it up in VIP with the dolly birds (Jesus, I've turned into me fatha) and spread all over the newspapers. As has been pointed out, your argument that shit black players get more grief than shit white ones says more about you than anyone else in St James'. All shit players get grief, but you only take to heart the grief given to black players. Around me there have been one man crusades against virtually every player at the club. Carr, O'Brien and Butt have all victims but also good players like Bellamy, Robert and even Shearer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ketsbaia 0 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 O'Brien got as much, if not more stick than Bramble. FACT! 48712[/snapback] Nonsense Gol. Bramble has always taken more abuse than AOB. FACT! 48714[/snapback] Utter shite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bez 0 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 Good players get no grief, regardless of creed or colour. Mostly, in most cases it is the case. However, the point remains. Black players on Tyneside have more work to do to win fans over than White ones. Black players get still get tacit abuse which we seem to accept e.g. bling bastard. White ones dont. why? Acceptable? 48733[/snapback] Whey that's cos you couldn't rightly describe any of our white players as bling! I never heard about Stephen Carr asking for the coach to be stopped so he could go and get his diamond earrings and I never saw Andy O'Brien out on the tiles, let alone swanking it up in VIP with the dolly birds (Jesus, I've turned into me fatha) and spread all over the newspapers. As has been pointed out, your argument that shit black players get more grief than shit white ones says more about you than anyone else in St James'. All shit players get grief, but you only take to heart the grief given to black players. Around me there have been one man crusades against virtually every player at the club. Carr, O'Brien and Butt have all victims but also good players like Bellamy, Robert and even Shearer. 48743[/snapback] Never saw Stephen Carr described by 'fans' using terms that are tacitly racist terms either. I couldnt give a toss who gets grief if its a level playing field. Its not though. If it was then the likes of Bowyer, Carr, Butt would have been castigated at the same rate Jenas, Dyer, Babayaro and Faye were. DO you think that shit black players are treated equally? Even in terms of form. Not there quality? Is that helpful? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shearergol 0 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 Sometimes I get the feeling that the main people who dont treat a person equally are those that highlight the "problem". To list half a dozen black players and say that they are receiving abuse because of their skin colour means that you yourself see them differently to other players. Every one of those players listed gets abuse because of the way in which they play and/or project themselves outside the game not because of the colour of their skin, I can honestly say that I dont even think about the skin colour in any views I have on a player, I havent excused things done by the likes of Bowyer, Bellamy, Robert, Butt and Butt again purely because he deserves to be listed twice because they're white. In the same way as I havent called a player because hes black. If they do well they get credit regardless of skin colour, sexual preference or anything else. Same goes for if they're shite or acting like arseholes, they'll get slagged off, white, black, asian or even Australian. Football fans get a bad press sometimes, if theres 50,000 people in a small enclosed space and you hear one racist taunt that doesnt make footballers racist just the same as hearing someone say something at work doesnt make the company racist. 48720[/snapback] SWEEP UNDER CARPET? Explain why Babayaro gets the 'bling bastard' comments when playing well - and people say he is shite when clearly he has done well. Whilst Stephen Carr doesnt get any such moniker for playing worse? Is the moniker - widely used - acceptable? We all know its connotations and what it actually mens in that context. Nb: |Regardless of the fact that you wish to sweep it under the carpet, I assume you have accepted that its not YOU personally I am talking of. However, it DOES exist. More widespread than youre prepared to acknowledge. It happens on this forum. Regularly. 48723[/snapback] Did you not rate Carr highly in yesterday's game, whilst I said he was shite? Surely that's me being racist? 48725[/snapback] Carr has been poor this season. Yesterday he did fine. So what? I see people didnt resort to descibing him as a ??? bastard though. did they. Babayaro, however, gets a slightly different response. Not from you. However, youre attitude makes you as cuplable as them at present. Idiot. 48728[/snapback] Sorry, I failed to spot that you were purely stating the obvious that racism does actually exist in this world. Congratulations for spotting that one. Just how many Newcastle supporters to that apply to by the way, based on your evidence and findings? Loving the irony that after you resorted to personal attacks, you then complained when it happened back to you. Bit lazy minded that one. "you're" btw 48732[/snapback] It's called irony. I apologise for using shorthand. In future, I will draw you pictures and post you crayons to colour it in with. Try to use them all. Well done on trivialising an important issue. One that is obvious but you DONT WANT to see. 48735[/snapback] What's called irony? That you got the grammar wrong? Congratulations on skipping every single point and question in my post though. Just how many Newcastle supporters does that apply to by the way, based on your evidence and findings? By the way, Gemmill has already used your put-down, just today in fact. Not very original of you tbh, and he's a lot funnier than you anyway 48737[/snapback] Hes more intelligent than you. He acknowledged that there is a problem. However, he did use the caveat (look it up on google) that it wasnt him! You really are the type of person that allows these issues to continue. Not quite bright enough to see the problem but too smug to acknowledge your own ignorance. Now, for the third time. Is 'bling bastard' an acceptable term in that context? Not that you have skipped it. Thats ironic too. 48740[/snapback] Here's me acknowledging it, a few posts back... Sorry, I failed to spot that you were purely stating the obvious that racism does actually exist in this world. Congratulations for spotting that one. That one ok for you? You're basing this "FACT" on your own opinion. Of course racism exists, we can all see it (towards all races, not just blacks) and I know you're not stupid enough to think that I refuse to acknowledge it (although maybe you are). Please please please show me some evidence where black players have to work twice as hard to be accepted at Newcastle. As for the bling bastard comments, I'm failing to see your point. Dyer is called bling because he wears bling. Jenas is called bling because he wears bling. Babayaro is called bling because he wears bling. If Carr turned up to a press conference wearing bling then I'm sure he'll get the label too. However, being labelled an "anything" bastard isn't acceptable in my opinion, regardless of colour. What's your point anyway, that Newcastle United are a racist club, or that some people in this world are racist. You're laughable at best mate. To say I was one of those championing for you to be unbanned on N-O, I'm beginning to wonder what the hell I was thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bez 0 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 (edited) Sometimes I get the feeling that the main people who dont treat a person equally are those that highlight the "problem". To list half a dozen black players and say that they are receiving abuse because of their skin colour means that you yourself see them differently to other players. Every one of those players listed gets abuse because of the way in which they play and/or project themselves outside the game not because of the colour of their skin, I can honestly say that I dont even think about the skin colour in any views I have on a player, I havent excused things done by the likes of Bowyer, Bellamy, Robert, Butt and Butt again purely because he deserves to be listed twice because they're white. In the same way as I havent called a player because hes black. If they do well they get credit regardless of skin colour, sexual preference or anything else. Same goes for if they're shite or acting like arseholes, they'll get slagged off, white, black, asian or even Australian. Football fans get a bad press sometimes, if theres 50,000 people in a small enclosed space and you hear one racist taunt that doesnt make footballers racist just the same as hearing someone say something at work doesnt make the company racist. 48720[/snapback] SWEEP UNDER CARPET? Explain why Babayaro gets the 'bling bastard' comments when playing well - and people say he is shite when clearly he has done well. Whilst Stephen Carr doesnt get any such moniker for playing worse? Is the moniker - widely used - acceptable? We all know its connotations and what it actually mens in that context. Nb: |Regardless of the fact that you wish to sweep it under the carpet, I assume you have accepted that its not YOU personally I am talking of. However, it DOES exist. More widespread than youre prepared to acknowledge. It happens on this forum. Regularly. 48723[/snapback] Did you not rate Carr highly in yesterday's game, whilst I said he was shite? Surely that's me being racist? 48725[/snapback] Carr has been poor this season. Yesterday he did fine. So what? I see people didnt resort to descibing him as a ??? bastard though. did they. Babayaro, however, gets a slightly different response. Not from you. However, youre attitude makes you as cuplable as them at present. Idiot. 48728[/snapback] Sorry, I failed to spot that you were purely stating the obvious that racism does actually exist in this world. Congratulations for spotting that one. Just how many Newcastle supporters to that apply to by the way, based on your evidence and findings? Loving the irony that after you resorted to personal attacks, you then complained when it happened back to you. Bit lazy minded that one. "you're" btw 48732[/snapback] It's called irony. I apologise for using shorthand. In future, I will draw you pictures and post you crayons to colour it in with. Try to use them all. Well done on trivialising an important issue. One that is obvious but you DONT WANT to see. 48735[/snapback] What's called irony? That you got the grammar wrong? Congratulations on skipping every single point and question in my post though. Just how many Newcastle supporters does that apply to by the way, based on your evidence and findings? By the way, Gemmill has already used your put-down, just today in fact. Not very original of you tbh, and he's a lot funnier than you anyway 48737[/snapback] Hes more intelligent than you. He acknowledged that there is a problem. However, he did use the caveat (look it up on google) that it wasnt him! You really are the type of person that allows these issues to continue. Not quite bright enough to see the problem but too smug to acknowledge your own ignorance. Now, for the third time. Is 'bling bastard' an acceptable term in that context? Not that you have skipped it. Thats ironic too. 48740[/snapback] Here's me acknowledging it, a few posts back... Sorry, I failed to spot that you were purely stating the obvious that racism does actually exist in this world. Congratulations for spotting that one. That one ok for you? You're basing this "FACT" on your own opinion. Of course racism exists, we can all see it (towards all races, not just blacks) and I know you're not stupid enough to think that I refuse to acknowledge it (although maybe you are). Please please please show me some evidence where black players have to work twice as hard to be accepted at Newcastle. As for the bling bastard comments, I'm failing to see your point. Dyer is called bling because he wears bling. Jenas is called bling because he wears bling. Babayaro is called bling because he wears bling. If Carr turned up to a press conference wearing bling then I'm sure he'll get the label too. However, being labelled an "anything" bastard isn't acceptable in my opinion, regardless of colour. What's your point anyway, that Newcastle United are a racist club, or that some people in this world are racist. You're laughable at best mate. To say I was one of those championing for you to be unbanned on N-O, I'm beginning to wonder what the hell I was thinking. 48747[/snapback] Not surprisingly, bling is often dismissed as a shallow and crass celebration of material wealth. But as a new documentary for 1Xtra, the BBC's black music radio station, explains, its origins are far from superficial. HOW BLING CAME TO BE 'Bling-bling' was coined in the late 90s Rap family the Cash Money Millionaires credited with thinking up the word Used as a song title by Cash Money artist Baby Gangsta ... the evolution of black music and image back to the civil rights movement in 1960s America. Black music and image intrinsically linked to black people. Bling bastard? Acceptable or not? I have no problem with you Gol. Never had. Nor Gemmill. My point is to stir debate on Kick Racism out of Football Day. It needs intelligent people - and I think you two are intelligent (hence the lazy minded today comment)- to discuss it. In the end look at the comment from the BBC. Bling is a term for and from black culture. It is unacceptable, regardless of whether or not we (wrongly) see bling as just being a big diamond ring, to use it in the terms it used. 'Bling bastard' has a tacit racist connotation for many. You? No. Me? No. but their is certainly bile their from many. Is Tyneside racist? Not sure. However, I still beleive that we havea problem bigger than we care to acknowledge. Edited October 24, 2005 by bez Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shearergol 0 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 As for the bling bastard comments, I'm failing to see your point. Dyer is called bling because he wears bling. Jenas is called bling because he wears bling. Babayaro is called bling because he wears bling. If Carr turned up to a press conference wearing bling then I'm sure he'll get the label too. However, being labelled an "anything" bastard isn't acceptable in my opinion, regardless of colour. As for the bling bastard comments, I'm failing to see your point. Dyer is called bling because he wears bling. Jenas is called bling because he wears bling. Babayaro is called bling because he wears bling. If Carr turned up to a press conference wearing bling then I'm sure he'll get the label too. However, being labelled an "anything" bastard isn't acceptable in my opinion, regardless of colour. As for the bling bastard comments, I'm failing to see your point. Dyer is called bling because he wears bling. Jenas is called bling because he wears bling. Babayaro is called bling because he wears bling. If Carr turned up to a press conference wearing bling then I'm sure he'll get the label too. However, being labelled an "anything" bastard isn't acceptable in my opinion, regardless of colour. As for the bling bastard comments, I'm failing to see your point. Dyer is called bling because he wears bling. Jenas is called bling because he wears bling. Babayaro is called bling because he wears bling. If Carr turned up to a press conference wearing bling then I'm sure he'll get the label too. However, being labelled an "anything" bastard isn't acceptable in my opinion, regardless of colour. As for the bling bastard comments, I'm failing to see your point. Dyer is called bling because he wears bling. Jenas is called bling because he wears bling. Babayaro is called bling because he wears bling. If Carr turned up to a press conference wearing bling then I'm sure he'll get the label too. However, being labelled an "anything" bastard isn't acceptable in my opinion, regardless of colour. Hello???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 Never saw Stephen Carr described by 'fans' using terms that are tacitly racist terms either. I couldnt give a toss who gets grief if its a level playing field. Its not though. If it was then the likes of Bowyer, Carr, Butt would have been castigated at the same rate Jenas, Dyer, Babayaro and Faye were. DO you think that shit black players are treated equally? Even in terms of form. Not there quality? Is that helpful? 48746[/snapback] Which players have been "described by 'fans' using terms that are tacitly racist terms"? What were these racist taunts? Are you saying 'bling' is a racist term? If you are then don't be daft. Beckham is the original bling footballer. I think it's safe to say that Jenas and Dyer get less shit than Butt did and Carr does. Bowyer's not been too bad and gats slagged off mostly for being a racist thug! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bez 0 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 As for the bling bastard comments, I'm failing to see your point. Dyer is called bling because he wears bling. Jenas is called bling because he wears bling. Babayaro is called bling because he wears bling. If Carr turned up to a press conference wearing bling then I'm sure he'll get the label too. However, being labelled an "anything" bastard isn't acceptable in my opinion, regardless of colour. As for the bling bastard comments, I'm failing to see your point. Dyer is called bling because he wears bling. Jenas is called bling because he wears bling. Babayaro is called bling because he wears bling. If Carr turned up to a press conference wearing bling then I'm sure he'll get the label too. However, being labelled an "anything" bastard isn't acceptable in my opinion, regardless of colour. As for the bling bastard comments, I'm failing to see your point. Dyer is called bling because he wears bling. Jenas is called bling because he wears bling. Babayaro is called bling because he wears bling. If Carr turned up to a press conference wearing bling then I'm sure he'll get the label too. However, being labelled an "anything" bastard isn't acceptable in my opinion, regardless of colour. As for the bling bastard comments, I'm failing to see your point. Dyer is called bling because he wears bling. Jenas is called bling because he wears bling. Babayaro is called bling because he wears bling. If Carr turned up to a press conference wearing bling then I'm sure he'll get the label too. However, being labelled an "anything" bastard isn't acceptable in my opinion, regardless of colour. As for the bling bastard comments, I'm failing to see your point. Dyer is called bling because he wears bling. Jenas is called bling because he wears bling. Babayaro is called bling because he wears bling. If Carr turned up to a press conference wearing bling then I'm sure he'll get the label too. However, being labelled an "anything" bastard isn't acceptable in my opinion, regardless of colour. Hello???? 48751[/snapback] Not surprisingly, bling is often dismissed as a shallow and crass celebration of material wealth. But as a new documentary for 1Xtra, the BBC's black music radio station, explains, its origins are far from superficial. HOW BLING CAME TO BE 'Bling-bling' was coined in the late 90s Rap family the Cash Money Millionaires credited with thinking up the word Used as a song title by Cash Money artist Baby Gangsta .....(links to the) the evolution of black music and image back to the civil rights movement in 1960s America. Black music and image intrinsically linked to black people. Bling bastard? Acceptable or not? I have no problem with you Gol. Never had. Nor Gemmill. My point is to stir debate on Kick Racism out of Football Day. It needs intelligent people - and I think you two are intelligent (hence the lazy minded today comment)- to discuss it. In the end look at the comment from the BBC. Bling is a term for and from black culture. It is unacceptable, regardless of whether or not we (wrongly) see bling as just being a big diamond ring, to use it in the terms it used. 'Bling bastard' has a tacit racist connotation for many. You? No. Me? No. but their is certainly bile their from many. Is Tyneside racist? Not sure. However, I still beleive that we havea problem bigger than we care to acknowledge. That was the reply Gol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peasepud 59 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 Black music and image intrinsically linked to black people. Bling bastard? Acceptable or not? 48750[/snapback] Im sorry but this is a farce of an argument. Can I ask where the bling bastard argument appeared because this is the first time Ive ever heard it mentioned either here, the pub or SJP. The fact that bling is linked to black music is irrelevant, are we saying that if someone made the same comment about Beckham (because lets face it hes bling) then they would be racist? All this backs up my original point, those that seek out racism in any comment against a black person are acknowledging that they personally see that person as different. If people have used the bling put down against Baba then its because of that, the fact that he is bling not because hes black, thats not racist, bling is something thats across all colours and creed. And can we stop the personal attacks, if someone disagrees with your view then put back a valid argument rather than resort to abuse (and thats for everyone not just those disagreeing with my views). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peasepud 59 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 also can we edit the quotes before posting? its doing me heed in scrolling through ream after ream of quotes to see one line of reply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 (edited) Black music and image intrinsically linked to black people. Bling bastard? Acceptable or not? I have no problem with you Gol. Never had. Nor Gemmill. My point is to stir debate on Kick Racism out of Football Day. It needs intelligent people - and I think you two are intelligent (hence the lazy minded today comment)- to discuss it. In the end look at the comment from the BBC. Bling is a term for and from black culture. It is unacceptable, regardless of whether or not we (wrongly) see bling as just being a big diamond ring, to use it in the terms it used. 'Bling bastard' has a tacit racist connotation for many. You? No. Me? No. but their is certainly bile their from many. Is Tyneside racist? Not sure. However, I still beleive that we havea problem bigger than we care to acknowledge. 48750[/snapback] So you don't think 'bling' is a racist term* and you think anyone who plays shit gets abuse. So we're all in agreement. It's very noble to start a racism debate but the suggestion that criticism on this board has a racist connotation is wide of the mark I think. *Anyone who does is insane. The notion that the use of a phrase coined by a black person is in itself racist is possibly the most racist thing I've EVER heard. Edited October 24, 2005 by Happy Face Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bez 0 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 also can we edit the quotes before posting? its doing me heed in scrolling through ream after ream of quotes to see one line of reply. 48757[/snapback] Cant agree peasepud Bling, as you have read, is intrinsically linked to black music and culture Bling bastard is thus not 'diamond wearing bastard' is it? I will let you work it out. Do a search on Newcastle forums for bling. See the association. We dont get that analogy or similar used with our white players. That is the point Personally, I am certain that black players (like most balck employees) have more to prove than their white equivalent. I will keep pointing that out at work, union meetings and here until its a level playing field. That is the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snakehips 0 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 The expression 'Old Hat' was a 17th century reference to a ladie's genitalia, believe it or not. It's meaning now is somewhat different. The rhyming slang 'Bottle and glass' was reference to someone's class. The term 'bottle' (an abbreviation) is somewhat different now. The term 'Bling' was used for black music/culture?? Well I suggest that it has now a somewhat different meaning, as have the aforementioned expressions. Yes, there is racism in Newcastle; there is racism in every country of the world I would argue. Are you mistaking racism with colour prejudice, I wonder??? Now I didn't half give some stick to 'Bart' Stimpson when he was here........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bez 0 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 Black music and image intrinsically linked to black people. Bling bastard? Acceptable or not? I have no problem with you Gol. Never had. Nor Gemmill. My point is to stir debate on Kick Racism out of Football Day. It needs intelligent people - and I think you two are intelligent (hence the lazy minded today comment)- to discuss it. In the end look at the comment from the BBC. Bling is a term for and from black culture. It is unacceptable, regardless of whether or not we (wrongly) see bling as just being a big diamond ring, to use it in the terms it used. 'Bling bastard' has a tacit racist connotation for many. You? No. Me? No. but their is certainly bile their from many. Is Tyneside racist? Not sure. However, I still beleive that we havea problem bigger than we care to acknowledge. 48750[/snapback] So you don't think 'bling' is a racist term* and you think anyone who plays shit gets abuse. So we're all in agreement. It's very noble to start a racism debate but the suggestion that criticism on this board has a racist connotation is wide of the mark I think. *Anyone who does is insane. The notion that the use of a phrase coined by a black person is in itself racist is possibly the most racist thing I've EVER heard. 48760[/snapback] Some black people use the term 'nigga' doesnt mean we can start saying it does it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bez 0 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 The expression 'Old Hat' was a 17th century reference to a ladie's genitalia, believe it or not. It's meaning now is somewhat different. The rhyming slang 'Bottle and glass' was reference to someone's class. The term 'bottle' (an abbreviation) is somewhat different now. The term 'Bling' was used for black music/culture?? Well I suggest that it has now a somewhat different meaning, as have the aforementioned expressions. Yes, there is racism in Newcastle; there is racism in every country of the world I would argue. Are you mistaking racism with colour prejudice, I wonder??? Now I didn't half give some stick to 'Bart' Stimpson when he was here........ 48763[/snapback] Valid point. totally ignores the context and associated vitriol though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peasepud 59 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 also can we edit the quotes before posting? its doing me heed in scrolling through ream after ream of quotes to see one line of reply. 48757[/snapback] Cant agree peasepud Bling, as you have read, is intrinsically linked to black music and culture Bling bastard is thus not 'diamond wearing bastard' is it? I will let you work it out. Do a search on Newcastle forums for bling. See the association. We dont get that analogy or similar used with our white players. That is the point Personally, I am certain that black players (like most balck employees) have more to prove than their white equivalent. I will keep pointing that out at work, union meetings and here until its a level playing field. That is the point. 48762[/snapback] But the point that many people on here are making is that the use of the bling put down is nothing to do with the colour of the skin or the origins of the word its to do with the actual bling, the fact that not many of the white players wear the bling is the reason why they dont get called for it. I'd be interested to get some views from black fans however we dont know who they are on here because surprise surprise we've never bothered to ask the question for one simple reason, its irrelevant to any discussions we have. Regardless of your own personal view I think you'll find that overall the extremely vast majority of Newcastle fans couldnt give a rats arse what colour the player is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bez 0 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 also can we edit the quotes before posting? its doing me heed in scrolling through ream after ream of quotes to see one line of reply. 48757[/snapback] Cant agree peasepud Bling, as you have read, is intrinsically linked to black music and culture Bling bastard is thus not 'diamond wearing bastard' is it? I will let you work it out. Do a search on Newcastle forums for bling. See the association. We dont get that analogy or similar used with our white players. That is the point Personally, I am certain that black players (like most balck employees) have more to prove than their white equivalent. I will keep pointing that out at work, union meetings and here until its a level playing field. That is the point. 48762[/snapback] But the point that many people on here are making is that the use of the bling put down is nothing to do with the colour of the skin or the origins of the word its to do with the actual bling, the fact that not many of the white players wear the bling is the reason why they dont get called for it. I'd be interested to get some views from black fans however we dont know who they are on here because surprise surprise we've never bothered to ask the question for one simple reason, its irrelevant to any discussions we have. Regardless of your own personal view I think you'll find that overall the extremely vast majority of Newcastle fans couldnt give a rats arse what colour the player is. 48768[/snapback] I probably agree that most fans are opposed to racism. In the same way we all tend to oppose sexism. However, there are massive problems in getting society to level itself out. Black workers are generally (and of course there are exceptions) not treated equally. It doesnt always happen. We know that. Its a serious issue. Same for women in the workplace. Hence men get paid more than women generally and get promoted more easily. The vast majority of managers in the UK say they arent sexist or racist. So how does this still happen? Well, sometimes we (some of us) cant avoid our own prejudice. In many ways we are the judges of the workers at NUFC. Why should our fans be any different to what society knows? That black 'workers' (substitute workers for players) have to prove themselves more and are given less opportunity to do so. The vitriol that occurs when - and 'bling bastard' is simply one example - the term is used is the issue that needs looking at. Why use a term thay we all know is linked to the black population? I still think black players have more to do at NUFC than white ones. that is my issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peasepud 59 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 Some black people use the term 'nigga' doesnt mean we can start saying it does it? 48764[/snapback] Well thats another argument altogether but one worth pursuing, if a term is acceptable in the community its referring to then why cant other races use that term? Personally I always think its a terrible word which can only be a put down but if its used widely in the black community then can it be racist? I dont know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 Some black people use the term 'nigga' doesnt mean we can start saying it does it? 48764[/snapback] What do you mean 'we'? What group are you referring to that we both belong to? Newcastle fans? Or have you made the rather racist assumption that I'm white? 'Nigga', is a completely different matter, its comm use was amongst white people as a racist term, it's overuse by black people dilutes its power to offend, in the same way gays adopt 'Fag' as an endearing term. These terms are used so that cretins are robbed of their power to offend. It's too soon but I believe many years down the line'nigga' will be robbed of any negative connotation whatsoever. Will you make your mind up, you said earlier that you personally thought bling wasn't a racist term but you continue to insinuate that this board is inherently racist for calling bling people bling! Personally I think anyone who wears a vulgar amount of jewlery should take a look at themselves and I would be insulted to be called bling. It's derogatory but not racist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peasepud 59 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 The vitriol that occurs when - and 'bling bastard' is simply one example - the term is used is the issue that needs looking at. Why use a term thay we all know is linked to the black population? 48770[/snapback] But are you saying then that if we had a black player who totally immersed himself in their black culture so that there was nothing you could refer to which wasnt in some way related to the colour of their skin then that player should be immune from criticism for fear of sounding racist regardless of how poorly they performed or handled themselves off the pitch? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckypierre 0 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 Some black people use the term 'nigga' doesnt mean we can start saying it does it? 48764[/snapback] Well thats another argument altogether but one worth pursuing, if a term is acceptable in the community its referring to then why cant other races use that term? Personally I always think its a terrible word which can only be a put down but if its used widely in the black community then can it be racist? I dont know 48771[/snapback] all depends HOW its used. Same as 'bling bastard'. I'd say it certainly could be used in a racist manner but not necessarily. It comes down to whether bling is meant to be derogatory or just to identify. In the same way as lanky bastard is calling someone who's tall a bastard, bald bastard is calling someone who's bald a bastard, ginger bastard is having a pop at Gemmill. It could be that solely bastard is the insult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 21566 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 'Nigga', is a completely different matter, its comm use was amongst white people as a racist term, it's overuse by black people dilutes its power to offend, in the same way gays adopt 'Fag' as an endearing term. These terms are used so that cretins are robbed of their power to offend. It's too soon but I believe many years down the line'nigga' will be robbed of any negative connotation whatsoever. Will you make your mind up, you said earlier that you personally thought bling wasn't a racist term but you continue to insinuate that this board is inherently racist for calling bling people bling! Personally I think anyone who wears a vulgar amount of jewlery should take a look at themselves and I would be insulted to be called bling. It's derogatory but not racist. 48772[/snapback] Exactly. I noticed bez hasn't bothered to answer if it is racist to call Beckham a bling bastard yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 21566 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 Tell me bez, why do you feel its necessary to change your user name every ten minutes? I'm curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bez 0 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 The vitriol that occurs when - and 'bling bastard' is simply one example - the term is used is the issue that needs looking at. Why use a term thay we all know is linked to the black population? 48770[/snapback] But are you saying then that if we had a black player who totally immersed himself in their black culture so that there was nothing you could refer to which wasnt in some way related to the colour of their skin then that player should be immune from criticism for fear of sounding racist regardless of how poorly they performed or handled themselves off the pitch? 48773[/snapback] No. i used 'bling' as an example. In its real sense the use of the term 'bling bastard' is another way of saying 'black bastard' For some that is how it is used. Its just an example. I agree with the other word that i try to avoid thinking of never mind typing. Did you see what i meant by the other comments on the previous post? Do they make sense? Women? Black people have to try harder generally in society. Why are we the exception? Were not in my opinion. I dont doubt the black players played poorly. I have said that myself many times. I just feel they get less chance than white ones. WE arent as tolerant in my view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bez 0 Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 Happy face. 'We' was meant to mean you and me. i dont like ostentatious use of jewelry either but its a different matter. Some psychologists reckon jewellry is just a way of avoiding/deflecting from yourself anyway. I've never been shy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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