Andrew 4856 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Wouldn't call that diving though, the problem is penalties and red cards being given off the back of no/minimal contact, it would take less time for a guy in a studio with replays to have another look and advise the ref than the referee takes to send all the players crowding round him away or go and talk to the linesman anyway. Young wasn't avoiding an injury when he chucked himself down against villa or qpr, he was cheating for an unfair advantage While the next time Steeeeeevie geeee goes in two footed on someone and they jump out the way, not cheating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lake Bells tits 1 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 It immediately sounds like an easy fix, but is referees a bigger part of the game than we like to think? Would the charm remain if games became fragmented into pieces because of constant video-decisions? Goal-line technology should be implemented full stop, but Im still on the fence in regards to tackles etc... there are so many factors and aspects involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckyluke 2 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 A major, major problem with diving and refereeing in general in this country is the cast iron assertion is that the referee's view of an incident should be upheld. The FA refuse to go against the decisions, presumably in the belief that it would undermine the referee and therefore reduce their credibility. This is of course nonsense, it only goes to undermine the confidence in the referees and the FA further. What needs to happen is a change in thinking, to admit that referees are human and can make the incorrect decision - this may be through no fault of their own, as we often here they do not have the benefit of multiple slow motion replays. But WE do have that benefit, so let's use it and ban the divers like Young and rescind the stupid red cards like Derry. Obviously it would be ideal if this was all on the spot, but even some retrospective justice would be better than the farce we have at the minute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew 4856 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 It immediately sounds like an easy fix, but is referees a bigger part of the game than we like to think? Would the charm remain if games became fragmented into pieces because of constant video-decisions? Goal-line technology should be implemented full stop, but Im still on the fence in regards to tackles etc... there are so many factors and aspects involved. There is loads of time in game for stuff like this, we get to see all the replays in 90 minutes after all, few major incidents are left unseen til the analysis at the end and like I said, whenever a big decision does happen the ref usually has time where theyre sending players away, discussing with captains or assistants, another guy in a room with a screen checking whats happened while all that goes on won't break flow at all IMO. It doesnt have to be a big screen waiting for the decision like the cricket, it could be totally under the radar, just to the refs earpiece Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew 4856 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Also I agree with Luke, if this doesn't happen the fa needs to wise up, do more work and become more involved in righting these wrongs after the matches. They're lazy and they're idiots as it stands and never really do anything that doesn't fit that remit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lake Bells tits 1 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Yep, but to what degree will this affect the judge in terms of trusting his own judgement - making a call there and then? Will some judges eventually end up waiting for the video judging before making ANY decision? It basically voids the real-time ref of any credibility and judging will start to be done from the sidelines by people with their arse sat on chairs. There are implications beyond our immediate concerns coming into play here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew 4856 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 It doesn't at all, other sports have used video refs to great effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meenzer 15716 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 A major, major problem with diving and refereeing in general in this country is the cast iron assertion is that the referee's view of an incident should be upheld. The FA refuse to go against the decisions, presumably in the belief that it would undermine the referee and therefore reduce their credibility. This is of course nonsense, it only goes to undermine the confidence in the referees and the FA further. What needs to happen is a change in thinking, to admit that referees are human and can make the incorrect decision - this may be through no fault of their own, as we often here they do not have the benefit of multiple slow motion replays. But WE do have that benefit, so let's use it and ban the divers like Young and rescind the stupid red cards like Derry. Obviously it would be ideal if this was all on the spot, but even some retrospective justice would be better than the farce we have at the minute. All of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckyluke 2 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Yep, but to what degree will this affect the judge in terms of trusting his own judgement - making a call there and then? Will some judges eventually end up waiting for the video judging before making ANY decision? It basically voids the real-time ref of any credibility and judging will start to be done from the sidelines by people with their arse sat on chairs. There are implications beyond our immediate concerns coming into play here Perhaps but if it was all retrospective then this wouldn't be an issue. You're not righting the wrongly given penalty there and then but at least Ashley Young might be a bit more vertically stable if he knew he'd miss 2 games when he'd inevitably be found out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin S. Assilleekunt 1 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 The retrospective action LL speaks of would no doubt be influenced heavily by the media, and with the North/South divide being prominent in those circles (football journos), it'd be a case of 'all teams are equal, but some are more equal than others'. I agree with the main point of his post though, some of the decisions that are upheld are ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10963 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 I don't agree with Neville that diving is the same as going down easy. Young went looking for contact. He technically fouled Clarke. He kicked his left leg against Clarke's, that's a foul. When he went down under Hill's feather light touch, was going down easy. There was this buzzword "contact", but not enough to knock a professional athlete off his feet. Neville talks of anarchy if we were to bring in retrospective punishments, but there will always be disruption when new rules are enforced. The back pass rule for one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckyluke 2 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 I don't agree with Neville that diving is the same as going down easy. Young went looking for contact. He technically fouled Clarke. He kicked his left leg against Clarke's, that's a foul. When he went down under Hill's feather light touch, was going down easy. There was this buzzword "contact", but not enough to knock a professional athlete off his feet. Neville talks of anarchy if we were to bring in retrospective punishments, but there will always be disruption when new rules are enforced. The back pass rule for one. I think a problem we face if such retrospective punishments were introduced (which I doubt will ever happen) is that the FA, FIFA etc have been so blinkered in their support of their officials that touching a player in the penalty box (oo er) is now deemed an offence. Just look now on SSN when they have a ref to review the weekend's big decisions, even with the benefit of replays they very rarely disagree with a penalty decision so long as there is this magical 'contact'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10963 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 I think a problem we face if such retrospective punishments were introduced (which I doubt will ever happen) is that the FA, FIFA etc have been so blinkered in their support of their officials that touching a player in the penalty box (oo er) is now deemed an offence. Just look now on SSN when they have a ref to review the weekend's big decisions, even with the benefit of replays they very rarely disagree with a penalty decision so long as there is this magical 'contact'. Depressingly, It's hard to disagree with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin S. Assilleekunt 1 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 (edited) None of us are athletes who are capable of bursts of electrifying pace, so it's hard for us to say how much contact it'd take to knock you off balance in that situation. Edited May 2, 2012 by Kevin S. Assilleekunt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10963 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 None of us are athletes who are capable of bursts of electrifying pace, so it's hard for us to say how much contact it'd take to knock you off balance in that situation. true, but it's realistic to say that these athletes go down like nancies and we wouldn't because we're nails Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigWalrus 0 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 If you're walking down the street, merely tripping over a half inch paving slab can knock you flying. It's piss easy to get sent arse over tit from someone clipping your heels when you're running at pace. However, I don't think it's these cases where there is any dispute over the foul - it's where there is barely any contact at all, or where the player has gone in deliberately trying to win a foul. Boils my piss, but there's bugger all I can do about it other than call the offending player a c*nt and move on with my life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howay 12496 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 I don't agree with Neville that diving is the same as going down easy. Young went looking for contact. He technically fouled Clarke. He kicked his left leg against Clarke's, that's a foul. When he went down under Hill's feather light touch, was going down easy. There was this buzzword "contact", but not enough to knock a professional athlete off his feet. Neville talks of anarchy if we were to bring in retrospective punishments, but there will always be disruption when new rules are enforced. The back pass rule for one. Aye, I also disagreed with a fair portion of what Neville said he slowed everything down to frame by frame looking for any amount of contact before going "foul? yes, dive? yes" but it's the type of sport where you will make contact with defenders it doesn't make it a foul every single time that happens, when the contact is strong enough to impede the attackers progress I agree that is a foul but simply grazing the defenders leg isn't a foul. It is very tough to stop but the FA need to do something because it's fair to say a lot of people are sick of seeing things like players punting the ball miles away then searching for contact from the keeper so that the keeper gets a red and they get a pen, or knocking the ball sideways and then 'kicking' the defender in order to win a free kick. The point I agree with Neville is that players know that they often wont get a free kick or penalty without going down and this is also something that needs to be changed as it gives players a good reason to fall over, Tiote getting elbowed by Sessegnon was a good example he went down softly and rather than being annoyed at their own player for being irrational and getting himself sent off the mackems were going berserk at Tiote for diving and some were saying if he hadn't went down Sessegnon might have stayed on the pitch, maybe they were right but if so that's a good reason on why Tiote had to go down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobH 0 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Messi has just broken Gerd Muller's goals in a season record, he scored a hattrick taking him to 68 goals this season. Ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 46023 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Messi has just broken Gerd Muller's goals in a season record, he scored a hattrick taking him to 68 goals this season. Ridiculous. Couldn't do it when it mattered though could he, the pint sized sonofabitch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Took Bolton to win the second half. 3/1 at home. Spurs should have had daylight between them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 46023 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 I fancy Spurs to tire and Bolton to score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADP 0 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Wilkins commentating our match against QPR earlier this season was probably the worst commentary I've ever heard yup. It was outrageous Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney 0 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Reo Coker! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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