Cross-party fury over MP's arrest

[Fop 1]

Cross-party fury over MP's arrest

 

Cameron: In our democracy I do not think what has happened is right

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7753894.stm

 

The Lib Dems have called shadow immigration minister Damian Green's arrest a "mayday warning" for democracy amid cross-party anger over the move.

 

Mr Green was arrested by anti-terror officers, held for nine hours and had his two homes and offices searched as part of a Home Office leak inquiry.

 

Tory leader David Cameron called the police operation "alarming" and said the government had questions to answer.

 

But the Home Office said ministers were not informed until after the arrest.

 

'Democracy in danger'

 

Mr Cameron, London mayor Boris Johnson and Commons Speaker Michael Martin were all informed about the raids.

 

But Downing Street insisted ministers had not been given advance warning and Prime Minister Gordon Brown said it was purely a police matter.

 

 

The decision to make today's arrest was taken solely by the MPS without any ministerial knowledge or approval

Metropolitan Police

 

Q&A: Damian Green arrested

Nick Robinson's view

 

"I had no prior knowledge, the home secretary had no prior knowledge, I know of no other minister who had any prior knowledge," he told Sky News, adding: "I knew about it only after it had happened."

 

Mr Green was not charged with any offence but was released on bail until February, when he could face further questioning.

 

The Ashford MP, the Tories' immigration spokesman since 2005, has denied any wrongdoing and said "opposition politicians have a duty to hold the government to account".

 

Lib Dem leader Nick Clegg told the BBC that he was "really shocked" by Mr Green's arrest.

 

"This is something you might expect from a tin-pot dictatorship, not in a modern democracy," he said.

 

Given the culture of "extraordinary secrecy" in Whitehall, it was getting harder to hold the government to account and opposition MPs had a constitutional duty to keep "ministers on their toes", he added.

 

He called on Gordon Brown to "rule out any further use of anti-terrorism powers in cases that have nothing to do with terrorism," although the Metropolitan Police stressed the arrest was made under the Police and Criminal Evidence Act and not anti-terror legislation.

 

Some counter-terrorism officers were involved because they were the most "appropriate" to carry out such an operation, the Met said, but David Cameron attacked the "heavy-handed" way in which it took nine officers to make the arrest and search the premises.

 

"If they wanted to talk to Damian Green why not pick up the telephone and ask to talk to him," he said. "I think this is extraordinary that it was so heavy-handed and done in this way," said Mr Cameron.

 

"They have got questions to answer, frankly, I think government ministers have got questions to answer as well. If they didn't know, why weren't they told?

 

"What do they think about in Britain today, counter-terrorism police are spending their time searching an MP's office, arresting him, holding him for nine hours, all on a day when British citizens are being killed on the other side of the world and all because, as far as I can see, he made public some information that was in the public interest that the government found uncomfortable.

 

"Well, let's hope that our democracy hasn't come to that."

 

Leaks

 

Sir David Normington, the top civil servant at the Home Office, said he had taken the decision to ask for police help in identifying the source of a series of "leaks of sensitive information over an extended period," because the leaks had "risked undermining the effective operation of my department".

 

"The police investigation led to a junior member of the Home Office being arrested on 19 November and subsequently suspended from duty," said Sir David in a statement.

 

 

I am not sure this is good for British democracy

Denns MacShane

Labour MP

"Yesterday (Thursday), I was informed by the Metropolitan Police at about 1.45pm that a search was about to be conducted of the home and offices of a member of the Opposition front bench. I was subsequently told that an arrest had been made.

 

"Ministers were not involved in the decision to seek police assistance or in the subsequent investigation and were only told of the arrest after it had occurred."

 

The leaks thought to be at the centre of the investigation include:

 

* The November 2007 revelation that the home secretary knew the Security Industry Authority had granted licences to 5,000 illegal workers, but decided not to publicise it.

* The February 2008 news that an illegal immigrant had been employed as a cleaner in the House of Commons.

* A whips' list of potential Labour rebels in the vote on plans to increase the pre-charge terror detention limit to 42 days.

* A letter from the home secretary warning that a recession could lead to a rise in crime.

 

The Metropolitan Police confirmed Mr Green was arrested by members of its counter-terrorism command, thought to be Special Branch officers, at his home in Kent and searches were conducted at his homes in London and Kent and at two offices in Kent and London.

 

It said the investigation was not terrorism related but did fall within the counter-terror unit's remit and that it was made without the knowledge or approval of ministers.

 

'Fair game'

 

There was also concern about the arrest on the Labour benches.

 

Former minister Denis MacShane said that the Speaker should make clear that MPs were entitled to hold sensitive material in the same way as lawyers and doctors.

 

Mr Green said he was just doing his job and would do the same again

 

"To send a squad of counter terrorist officers to arrest an MP shows the growing police contempt for Parliament and democratic politics," he said.

 

"The police now believe that MPs are so reduced in public status that they are fair game for over-excited officers to order dawn raids, arrests and searches of confidential files held by MPs or those who work for them.

 

"I am not sure this is good for British democracy."

 

Police say Mr Green was held on suspicion of "conspiring to commit misconduct in a public office" and "aiding and abetting, counselling or procuring misconduct in a public office" - an obscure and little-used offence under common law.

 

One legal expert said it was doubtful whether any case would be brought against Mr Green.

 

"In a western democracy, I think it would be very surprising if an elected member of Parliament was put on trial for an offence which arises from him putting in the public domain material that he thinks should be there in the public interest," said Robert Brown, a partner at the law firm Corker Binning.

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7753763.stm

 

 

I know, I know, nothing wrong with it; if you've got something to say you deserve to be arrested under anti-terror law. [/usualsuspects]

Edited November 28, 2008 by Fop

[Park Life 71]

Wot for arresto?

[Fop 1]

Wot for arresto?

 

The leaks thought to be at the centre of the investigation include:

 

* The November 2007 revelation that the home secretary knew the Security Industry Authority had granted licences to 5,000 illegal workers, but decided not to publicise it.

* The February 2008 news that an illegal immigrant had been employed as a cleaner in the House of Commons.

* A whips' list of potential Labour rebels in the vote on plans to increase the pre-charge terror detention limit to 42 days.

* A letter from the home secretary warning that a recession could lead to a rise in crime.

Apparently........ of sweet FA in other words.

 

Embarrassing to the Government, but not exactly state secrets or of use to anyone.

[Happy Face 29]

We're in Zimbabwe!

 

[Fop 1]

We're in Zimbabwe!

 

In all honestly it seems we are.

 

Mind you it's certainly an efficient way for Labour to win the next elections, just arrest and detain all non-labour MP's.

[Park Life 71]

Wot for arresto?

 

The leaks thought to be at the centre of the investigation include:

 

* The November 2007 revelation that the home secretary knew the Security Industry Authority had granted licences to 5,000 illegal workers, but decided not to publicise it.

* The February 2008 news that an illegal immigrant had been employed as a cleaner in the House of Commons.

* A whips' list of potential Labour rebels in the vote on plans to increase the pre-charge terror detention limit to 42 days.

* A letter from the home secretary warning that a recession could lead to a rise in crime.

Apparently........ of sweet FA in other words.

 

Embarrassing to the Government, but not exactly state secrets or of use to anyone.

 

Leaks from the house are one a day are they not?

[Park Life 71]

We're in Zimbabwe!

 

 

But with expensive drugs.

[Fop 1]

Wot for arresto?

 

The leaks thought to be at the centre of the investigation include:

 

* The November 2007 revelation that the home secretary knew the Security Industry Authority had granted licences to 5,000 illegal workers, but decided not to publicise it.

* The February 2008 news that an illegal immigrant had been employed as a cleaner in the House of Commons.

* A whips' list of potential Labour rebels in the vote on plans to increase the pre-charge terror detention limit to 42 days.

* A letter from the home secretary warning that a recession could lead to a rise in crime.

Apparently........ of sweet FA in other words.

 

Embarrassing to the Government, but not exactly state secrets or of use to anyone.

 

Leaks from the house are one a day are they not?

More than that I'd say, but these aren't even direct leaks, he's just publicised/used other peoples leaked information. That's pretty much what MP's (and opposition MP's especially) are there to do.

 

It's a pretty nasty precedent really, I know I shouldn't say it , but very police state (I can't think of any other way to put it).

[Park Life 71]

Wot for arresto?

 

The leaks thought to be at the centre of the investigation include:

 

* The November 2007 revelation that the home secretary knew the Security Industry Authority had granted licences to 5,000 illegal workers, but decided not to publicise it.

* The February 2008 news that an illegal immigrant had been employed as a cleaner in the House of Commons.

* A whips' list of potential Labour rebels in the vote on plans to increase the pre-charge terror detention limit to 42 days.

* A letter from the home secretary warning that a recession could lead to a rise in crime.

Apparently........ of sweet FA in other words.

 

Embarrassing to the Government, but not exactly state secrets or of use to anyone.

 

Leaks from the house are one a day are they not?

More than that I'd say, but these aren't even direct leaks, he's just publicised/used other peoples leaked information. That's pretty much what MP's (and opposition MP's especially) are there to do.

 

It's a pretty nasty precedent really, I know I shouldn't say it , but very police state (I can't think of any other way to put it).

 

Lucky he wasn't tazered in the neck and sat on by three fat plod synchronised farting.

[Fop 1]

He [Nick Clegg Lib leader] called on Gordon Brown to "rule out any further use of anti-terrorism powers in cases that have nothing to do with terrorism,"

 

You've got to admire his optimism.

[Meenzer 15871]

[Fop 1]

Has this happened before?

 

No. It is unprecedented for an MP to be arrested and his office searched by police in connection with a leak inquiry. Mr Green is suspected of committing a common law offence, under an obscure and little-used piece of legislation. Legal experts have said charges are unlikely to be brought, and unlikely to succeed if they did go ahead.

Why are there fears about its impact on democracy?

 

There is concern the police are being used to silence critics of the government and prevent disclosure of embarrassing material - something firmly denied by ministers. Opposition parties and journalists have long relied on leaks of sensitive material to help them do their job of holding the government to account. Many internal leak inquiries have been launched over the years, but the perpetrators are rarely caught. The police have occasionally become involved but successful prosecutions are very rare.

[Park Life 71]

Has this happened before?

 

No. It is unprecedented for an MP to be arrested and his office searched by police in connection with a leak inquiry. Mr Green is suspected of committing a common law offence, under an obscure and little-used piece of legislation. Legal experts have said charges are unlikely to be brought, and unlikely to succeed if they did go ahead.

Why are there fears about its impact on democracy?

 

There is concern the police are being used to silence critics of the government and prevent disclosure of embarrassing material - something firmly denied by ministers. Opposition parties and journalists have long relied on leaks of sensitive material to help them do their job of holding the government to account. Many internal leak inquiries have been launched over the years, but the perpetrators are rarely caught. The police have occasionally become involved but successful prosecutions are very rare.

 

It's only the beginning. Wait for the 2012 limpics buildup.

[Fop 1]

I bet Vince Cable is -ing himself after his Mr. Bean crack about Brown.

 

 

4am wake up call for you Mr. Cable; "serious insults call for serious anti-terror legislation".

[Park Life 71]

I bet Vince Cable is -ing himself after his Mr. Bean crack about Brown.

 

 

4am wake up call for you Mr. Cable; "serious insults call for serious anti-terror legislation".

 

Full cs and tazer mix I shouldn't wonder + mind melding-meddling drugs back at the depo.

Edited November 28, 2008 by Park Life

[Meenzer 15871]

I bet Vince Cable is -ing himself after his Mr. Bean crack about Brown.

That and actually being right about the economy and speaking out (albeit several years too late). Death warrant signed tbh.

[Kevin Carr's Gloves 4090]

Cunt shouldn't be a tory if he wants sympathy.

[Fop 1]

Cunt shouldn't be a tory if he wants sympathy.

This rather transcends party politics.

 

Never in the history of Britain has this occurred before.

[Kevin Carr's Gloves 4090]

Cunt shouldn't be a tory if he wants sympathy.

This rather transcends party politics.

 

Never in the history of Britain has this occurred before.

 

As the son, nephew, grandson etc etc of miners I would like to batter every tory in britain for their illegal tactics during the miners strike so I re iterate. Cunt shouldn't be a tory if he wants sympathy.

[Fop 1]

Cunt shouldn't be a tory if he wants sympathy.

This rather transcends party politics.

 

Never in the history of Britain has this occurred before.

 

As the son, nephew, grandson etc etc of miners I would like to batter every tory in britain for their illegal tactics during the miners strike so I re iterate. Cunt shouldn't be a tory if he wants sympathy.

 

Again it's transcends party politics (more than a few Labour MPs are appalled by it), you may as well say "cunts shouldn't have been miners if they want sympathy", because it's just as daft and pointless.

[Kevin Carr's Gloves 4090]

Cunt shouldn't be a tory if he wants sympathy.

This rather transcends party politics.

 

Never in the history of Britain has this occurred before.

 

As the son, nephew, grandson etc etc of miners I would like to batter every tory in britain for their illegal tactics during the miners strike so I re iterate. Cunt shouldn't be a tory if he wants sympathy.

 

Again it's transcends party politics (more than a few Labour MPs are appalled by it), you may as well say "cunts shouldn't have been miners if they want sympathy", because it's just as daft and pointless.

 

Tories are wankers and I don't care if it transends politics I hope he gets bummed in prison.

[Fop 1]

Cunt shouldn't be a tory if he wants sympathy.

This rather transcends party politics.

 

Never in the history of Britain has this occurred before.

 

As the son, nephew, grandson etc etc of miners I would like to batter every tory in britain for their illegal tactics during the miners strike so I re iterate. Cunt shouldn't be a tory if he wants sympathy.

 

Again it's transcends party politics (more than a few Labour MPs are appalled by it), you may as well say "cunts shouldn't have been miners if they want sympathy", because it's just as daft and pointless.

 

Tories are wankers and I don't care if it transends politics I hope he gets bummed in prison.

I can see why the SNP swayed you to be honest.

 

(he won't be going to prison, though. It's highly unlikely he'll be going to court even. Because basically there is no real case [he has done nothing wrong] other than police intimidation/abuse of power.)

[Kevin Carr's Gloves 4090]

Cunt shouldn't be a tory if he wants sympathy.

This rather transcends party politics.

 

Never in the history of Britain has this occurred before.

 

As the son, nephew, grandson etc etc of miners I would like to batter every tory in britain for their illegal tactics during the miners strike so I re iterate. Cunt shouldn't be a tory if he wants sympathy.

 

Again it's transcends party politics (more than a few Labour MPs are appalled by it), you may as well say "cunts shouldn't have been miners if they want sympathy", because it's just as daft and pointless.

 

Tories are wankers and I don't care if it transends politics I hope he gets bummed in prison.

I can see why the SNP swayed you to be honest.

 

(he won't be going to prison, though. It's highly unlikely he'll be going to court even. Because basically there is no real case [he has done nothing wrong] other than police intimidation/abuse of power.)

 

Just so you know if it had been anyone else other than a tory I would be horrified but he is one so fuck him. They never cared about the North East.

[Fop 1]

Ex-Labour MP Tony Benn was just as incredulous: "I may sound strangely medieval, but once the police can interfere with Parliament, I tell you, you are into a police state."

 

 

Tony Benn & Fop.

[Fop 1]

Just so you know if it had been anyone else other than a tory I would be horrified but he is one so fuck him. They never cared about the North East.

It's completely irrelevant, though.

 

First they came for the Conservatives, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Conservative/hated them too....