manc-mag 1 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 I don't think theres any ambiguity around the point that membership of the BNP is a bar to membership of the constabulary (at least to the people that it directly affects, ie serving officers or prospective officers). Like you say if there is a debate to be had then it's a case of 'should this be the case'. To be honest I think in as far as the police is concerned it should be the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Okay, places like Bradford and Luton may have large amounts of Muslims living in the area but i'm yet to see any Islamic Party of Great Britain councillors elbowing their way into power in those areas. no, I'm not. I'm just saying that, its now only a matter of time, as things stand. You do see this don't you ? But even if they did, so what? those areas where they would gain power would be those with a vast majority of Muslims therefore why not have a councillor that understands them? Plus, my understanding of the Islamic party is that they promote integration rather than acting insular. Maybe they wil have more luck in getting those that currently dont attempt to fit in. what would life be like in those areas with a vast majority of muslims, for non - muslims ? An integrated, happy community ? Would it hell. They may be promoting integratation on the surface but is it working, will it work, are they really promoting it ? This is the point PP. The community may well represent the population of the country, but that ends up being a muslim community, totally intolerant of anyone else, starting off in Leicester, then Bradford, the burnley, then Luton ....... etc etc Is this desirable ? Do you think so ? If you are taking the view that its a natural process and you won't be alive when it happens, or you'll be too old to care, then fine, thats your prerogative. But thats admitting its going to happen. Personally I think a divided Britain isn't desirable at all in any shape or form. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sniffer 0 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Let's face it. The country has gone to shit and there is absolutely nothing anybody can do about it. The train has left the station a long time ago and anybody who thinks it's going to evolve into some kind of multicultural utopia is sadly mistaken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manc-mag 1 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Okay, places like Bradford and Luton may have large amounts of Muslims living in the area but i'm yet to see any Islamic Party of Great Britain councillors elbowing their way into power in those areas. no, I'm not. I'm just saying that, its now only a matter of time, as things stand. You do see this don't you ? But even if they did, so what? those areas where they would gain power would be those with a vast majority of Muslims therefore why not have a councillor that understands them? Plus, my understanding of the Islamic party is that they promote integration rather than acting insular. Maybe they wil have more luck in getting those that currently dont attempt to fit in. what would life be like in those areas with a vast majority of muslims, for non - muslims ? An integrated, happy community ? Would it hell. They may be promoting integratation on the surface but is it working, will it work, are they really promoting it ? This is the point PP. The community may well represent the population of the country, but that ends up being a muslim community, totally intolerant of anyone else, starting off in Leicester, then Bradford, the burnley, then Luton ....... etc etc Is this desirable ? Do you think so ? If you are taking the view that its a natural process and you won't be alive when it happens, or you'll be too old to care, then fine, thats your prerogative. But thats admitting its going to happen. Personally I think a divided Britain isn't desirable at all in any shape or form. Take some of your points on board there Leazes, but just to play devil's advocate can't you equally say this about non-muslim/'white' councils? They promote it but it doesnt happen, which ultimately is as much a failing of the non-muslims as it is the muslims. But I'm guessing (without having a go at you and perhaps wrongly) you're less concerned about it as long as it remains that way round? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Let's face it. The country has gone to shit and there is absolutely nothing anybody can do about it. The train has left the station a long time ago and anybody who thinks it's going to evolve into some kind of multicultural utopia is sadly mistaken. I don't think anyone was saying that, were they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 22008 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 I actually would share some of Leazes concerns without having the same sense of panic, vitriol, or fatalism. I would now like to see a signed constitution based on secular principles to allay some of my fears to start with, anyhow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 I actually would share some of Leazes concerns without having the same sense of panic, vitriol, or fatalism. I would now like to see a signed constitution based on secular principles to allay some of my fears to start with, anyhow. I think many, if not most, people do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ketsbaia 0 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Let's face it. The country has gone to shit and there is absolutely nothing anybody can do about it. The train has left the station a long time ago and anybody who thinks it's going to evolve into some kind of multicultural utopia is sadly mistaken. Has it though? Would you really prefer to live in the 60's, 70's, 80's or 90's than the 00's? We may be on the verge of recession but quality of life for the vast majority of people in the country is fantastic compared to what it has been in the past. We're hardly turning into a third world country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 22008 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Let's face it. The country has gone to shit and there is absolutely nothing anybody can do about it. The train has left the station a long time ago and anybody who thinks it's going to evolve into some kind of multicultural utopia is sadly mistaken. Has it though? Would you really prefer to live in the 60's, 70's, 80's or 90's than the 00's? We may be on the verge of recession but quality of life for the vast majority of people in the country is fantastic compared to what it has been in the past. We're hardly turning into a third world country. Are you not mistaking quality of life with standard of living? I'd much rather be in the 60s! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJS 4411 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 I actually would share some of Leazes concerns without having the same sense of panic, vitriol, or fatalism. I would now like to see a signed constitution based on secular principles to allay some of my fears to start with, anyhow. I think the "Muslim country in 60 years" is obviously shite but the underlying fear behind that is as you say reasonable. However I think the constitution both you and I would like to see is a long way off linked as it is to the monarchy. Having said that I'm hoping the idiocy of the jug-eared twat might open up a debate when he finally gets in which might see progress. I have to say I like the idea on mulitcultarism in principle - I would hate to see a homegenised society where everyone is "English" (whatever that really means) but the isolation of some communities is a stumbling block. It's not just Muslims on this btw - there are communities as far ranging asas orthodox jews and Scottish highlanders who I think lead very insular existences. I wouldn't force openness on theme but I'd certainly encourage it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 14013 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 England is fairly rough in some places. Mainly due to a lot more Chav's appearing, but that said a lot of them work hard and drive cars. The older ones who work encourage the younger ones by possessing material items etc etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ketsbaia 0 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 I actually would share some of Leazes concerns without having the same sense of panic, vitriol, or fatalism. I would now like to see a signed constitution based on secular principles to allay some of my fears to start with, anyhow. I think the "Muslim country in 60 years" is obviously shite but the underlying fear behind that is as you say reasonable. However I think the constitution both you and I would like to see is a long way off linked as it is to the monarchy. Having said that I'm hoping the idiocy of the jug-eared twat might open up a debate when he finally gets in which might see progress. I have to say I like the idea on mulitcultarism in principle - I would hate to see a homegenised society where everyone is "English" (whatever that really means) but the isolation of some communities is a stumbling block. It's not just Muslims on this btw - there are communities as far ranging asas orthodox jews and Scottish highlanders who I think lead very insular existences. I wouldn't force openness on theme but I'd certainly encourage it Jewtown in Gateshead is a good example. You can't get moved round there for skullcaps and beards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Multiculturalism isn't an option. It's the way forward for the whole of Europe and is ensrichned in copious amounts of legislation. People also need to get real, some of those towns in Birmingham and Leeds would be dead if it weren't for the enterprise and work ethic of the Muslim and Hindu communities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJS 4411 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Jewtown in Gateshead is a good example. You can't get moved round there for skullcaps and beards. That's fine by me if they still went to the Metro centre or maybe the match or for a meal in town. I'm sure that some do but as I say having their own schools, rarely marrying outside their group and erecting a sort of fence around them is wrong imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Let's face it. The country has gone to shit and there is absolutely nothing anybody can do about it. The train has left the station a long time ago and anybody who thinks it's going to evolve into some kind of multicultural utopia is sadly mistaken. Has it though? Would you really prefer to live in the 60's, 70's, 80's or 90's than the 00's? We may be on the verge of recession but quality of life for the vast majority of people in the country is fantastic compared to what it has been in the past. We're hardly turning into a third world country. Are you not mistaking quality of life with standard of living? I'd much rather be in the 60s! Rose-tinted nostalgia for a time you never knew imo. I'd imagine it was pretty grim in comparison to now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jusoda Kid 1 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Let's face it. The country has gone to shit and there is absolutely nothing anybody can do about it. The train has left the station a long time ago and anybody who thinks it's going to evolve into some kind of multicultural utopia is sadly mistaken. Has it though? Would you really prefer to live in the 60's, 70's, 80's or 90's than the 00's? We may be on the verge of recession but quality of life for the vast majority of people in the country is fantastic compared to what it has been in the past. We're hardly turning into a third world country. Are you not mistaking quality of life with standard of living? I'd much rather be in the 60s! Rose-tinted nostalgia for a time you never knew imo. I'd imagine it was pretty grim in comparison to now. But the drugs would have been better, therefore sprucing it up a bit imo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Jewtown in Gateshead is a good example. You can't get moved round there for skullcaps and beards. That's fine by me if they still went to the Metro centre or maybe the match or for a meal in town. I'm sure that some do but as I say having their own schools, rarely marrying outside their group and erecting a sort of fence around them is wrong imo. No need to have a pop at the Jews like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Let's face it. The country has gone to shit and there is absolutely nothing anybody can do about it. The train has left the station a long time ago and anybody who thinks it's going to evolve into some kind of multicultural utopia is sadly mistaken. Has it though? Would you really prefer to live in the 60's, 70's, 80's or 90's than the 00's? We may be on the verge of recession but quality of life for the vast majority of people in the country is fantastic compared to what it has been in the past. We're hardly turning into a third world country. Are you not mistaking quality of life with standard of living? I'd much rather be in the 60s! Rose-tinted nostalgia for a time you never knew imo. I'd imagine it was pretty grim in comparison to now. But the drugs would have been better, therefore sprucing it up a bit imo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ketsbaia 0 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Let's face it. The country has gone to shit and there is absolutely nothing anybody can do about it. The train has left the station a long time ago and anybody who thinks it's going to evolve into some kind of multicultural utopia is sadly mistaken. Has it though? Would you really prefer to live in the 60's, 70's, 80's or 90's than the 00's? We may be on the verge of recession but quality of life for the vast majority of people in the country is fantastic compared to what it has been in the past. We're hardly turning into a third world country. Are you not mistaking quality of life with standard of living? I'd much rather be in the 60s! Rose-tinted nostalgia for a time you never knew imo. I'd imagine it was pretty grim in comparison to now. Good music and good drugs. Apart from those I don't think the 60's was that good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Let's face it. The country has gone to shit and there is absolutely nothing anybody can do about it. The train has left the station a long time ago and anybody who thinks it's going to evolve into some kind of multicultural utopia is sadly mistaken. Has it though? Would you really prefer to live in the 60's, 70's, 80's or 90's than the 00's? We may be on the verge of recession but quality of life for the vast majority of people in the country is fantastic compared to what it has been in the past. We're hardly turning into a third world country. Are you not mistaking quality of life with standard of living? I'd much rather be in the 60s! Rose-tinted nostalgia for a time you never knew imo. I'd imagine it was pretty grim in comparison to now. But the drugs would have been better, therefore sprucing it up a bit imo On the contrary I reckon that's a complete myth as well. They're stronger and far more widely available now. If you're into that sort of thing I would imagine, as 2J would say, Newcastle was dryer than a nun's cunt back then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Let's face it. The country has gone to shit and there is absolutely nothing anybody can do about it. The train has left the station a long time ago and anybody who thinks it's going to evolve into some kind of multicultural utopia is sadly mistaken. Has it though? Would you really prefer to live in the 60's, 70's, 80's or 90's than the 00's? We may be on the verge of recession but quality of life for the vast majority of people in the country is fantastic compared to what it has been in the past. We're hardly turning into a third world country. Are you not mistaking quality of life with standard of living? I'd much rather be in the 60s! Rose-tinted nostalgia for a time you never knew imo. I'd imagine it was pretty grim in comparison to now. The Notting Hill race riots certainly had a better class of racist. Not your namby pamby modern BNPer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJS 4411 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Jewtown in Gateshead is a good example. You can't get moved round there for skullcaps and beards. That's fine by me if they still went to the Metro centre or maybe the match or for a meal in town. I'm sure that some do but as I say having their own schools, rarely marrying outside their group and erecting a sort of fence around them is wrong imo. No need to have a pop at the Jews like that. The thing is I have great admiration for Jewish pride in their culture and their loyalty to thatr notion but at the same time looking back on history I think their "insistence" on living seperately has done them no favours when it comes to the obvious persecution. I realise on some occasions they won't have had a choice of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jusoda Kid 1 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Jewtown in Gateshead is a good example. You can't get moved round there for skullcaps and beards. That's fine by me if they still went to the Metro centre or maybe the match or for a meal in town. I'm sure that some do but as I say having their own schools, rarely marrying outside their group and erecting a sort of fence around them is wrong imo. No need to have a pop at the Jews like that. The thing is I have great admiration for Jewish pride in their culture and their loyalty to thatr notion but at the same time looking back on history I think their "insistence" on living seperately has done them no favours when it comes to the obvious persecution. I realise on some occasions they won't have had a choice of course. You've only got to look as far as DannyB, he won't even post on his own forums Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ketsbaia 0 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Jewtown in Gateshead is a good example. You can't get moved round there for skullcaps and beards. That's fine by me if they still went to the Metro centre or maybe the match or for a meal in town. I'm sure that some do but as I say having their own schools, rarely marrying outside their group and erecting a sort of fence around them is wrong imo. No need to have a pop at the Jews like that. The thing is I have great admiration for Jewish pride in their culture and their loyalty to thatr notion but at the same time looking back on history I think their "insistence" on living seperately has done them no favours when it comes to the obvious persecution. I realise on some occasions they won't have had a choice of course. You've only got to look as far as DannyB, he won't even post on his own forums Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 (edited) Anyone watch "The Ascent of Money" on More4 last night. Interesting look at the negativity towards Jews descended from the times of Jewish money lenders. From Shylock's pound of flesh to the loan sharks of Glasgow, from the 'promises to pay' on Babylonian clay tablets to the Medici banking system, Professor Ferguson explains the origins of credit and debt and why credit networks are indispensable to any civilisation. http://www.channel4.com/history/microsites...s/episodes.html Repeated C4 Monday 24 Nov 8.00PM Edited November 20, 2008 by Happy Face Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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