South African Deal

[LeazesMag 0]

You can, aye. Basically it falls down to who you trust. I trust Keegan, you trust Ashley in other words.

 

And thats the magic statement, but I have to say even taking Keegan out of the equation, theres nothing been said or done by Ashley, Wise or the rest to give you any kind of trust in them. If anyone can give me a statement that Ashley has made in the last year that can be proved to be true then I'd be interested to see it.

 

precisely, even going down to putting up the 3 years season ticket money. I did it for the 10% saving knowing I would be paying anyway, but the fact that it wasn't invested in players and we are now in a real relegation fight and the club is in uproar pisses me off just slightly.

[Baggio 0]

In footballing terms its only a good piece of business if you either already have replacements sitting there ie a pool of talent in the wings or have someone lined up thats cheaper, better and younger than the one you're selling.

 

 

In the case of Milner it was good financial business for Ashley and nothing else.

 

Did you think selling Woodgate was good business?

 

How about selling off BR Pud? Seeing as we're changing the subject.

 

I'm not changing the subject at all, I think both were good business as long as the money was to be reinvested into the club, even if we would have to wait until january.

Do you really reckon we were 'keeping our powder dry' for a transfer bonanza in January like? Apart from the fact you'd have to wonder why targets would be easier to get then than in the summer.

 

I don't think he was keeping our powder dry, I think the money from Milner would have been available in January though as it came late in the window.

[Guest alex]

In footballing terms its only a good piece of business if you either already have replacements sitting there ie a pool of talent in the wings or have someone lined up thats cheaper, better and younger than the one you're selling.

 

 

In the case of Milner it was good financial business for Ashley and nothing else.

 

Did you think selling Woodgate was good business?

 

Yes but only because at the time anyone we had sitting in the wings would play more games than he was doing.

 

But we sold our best defender and didn't replace him until January, compare that to the Summer where we had Jonas and Geremi who I'd play over Milner and i can't see how one can be good business and the other not.

Oversimplifies things a bit though. For one thing I'd go with Milner ahead of Geremi but even allowing for Jonas being better we've got a small squad and we lost in Milner a decent player, who is also pretty versatile (I think the lad's ordinary, don't get me wrong) and he also has a very good attitude in terms of workrate and seemingly not minding playing in different positions. A player like that was valuable to our team (and still would be) because of the small squad we have. A quick look at the bench for games this season gives me serious concerns, especially given the bad start we've now had.

[Guest alex]

In footballing terms its only a good piece of business if you either already have replacements sitting there ie a pool of talent in the wings or have someone lined up thats cheaper, better and younger than the one you're selling.

 

 

In the case of Milner it was good financial business for Ashley and nothing else.

 

Did you think selling Woodgate was good business?

 

How about selling off BR Pud? Seeing as we're changing the subject.

 

I'm not changing the subject at all, I think both were good business as long as the money was to be reinvested into the club, even if we would have to wait until january.

Do you really reckon we were 'keeping our powder dry' for a transfer bonanza in January like? Apart from the fact you'd have to wonder why targets would be easier to get then than in the summer.

 

I don't think he was keeping our powder dry, I think the money from Milner would have been available in January though as it came late in the window.

It might have been. Imo a £4-5m young, unproven, foreigner would have been who'd came in though. It might have worked. Gamble though, with the profit margin being a key factor imo.

[Baggio 0]

You can, aye. Basically it falls down to who you trust. I trust Keegan, you trust Ashley in other words.

 

And thats the magic statement, but I have to say even taking Keegan out of the equation, theres nothing been said or done by Ashley, Wise or the rest to give you any kind of trust in them. If anyone can give me a statement that Ashley has made in the last year that can be proved to be true then I'd be interested to see it.

 

You see I think Keegan has been feeding the press all Summer long about what was going on behind the scenes which is why they were so sure of what they were writing, I also think he's been proven to be a liar by making out everything was alright to the fans while having off the record chats with Louise Taylor and co.

[Guest alex]

Oversimplifies things a bit though. For one thing I'd go with Milner ahead of Geremi but even allowing for Jonas being better we've got a small squad and we lost in Milner a decent player, who is also pretty versatile (I think the lad's ordinary, don't get me wrong) and he also has a very good attitude in terms of workrate and seemingly not minding playing in different positions. A player like that was valuable to our team (and still would be) because of the small squad we have. A quick look at the bench for games this season gives me serious concerns, especially given the bad start we've now had.

 

quick reminder at the amount of people going mental at me complaining of lack of signings weeks before the window closed..

indeed, between injuries and suspensions were going find it a long trek to January and even then were going need some serious wheeling and dealing to pad it out a bit.

 

Can we even get people in on loan atm?

Ant, I was one of them because I had misplaced faith in the club and their promises and ability to get people in. I seem to remember a quote from the club (Ashley?) about signings being likely to be very late in the window and even on deadline day and I believed it. You were totally spot on though and I couldn't have been more wrong.

[Baggio 0]

In footballing terms its only a good piece of business if you either already have replacements sitting there ie a pool of talent in the wings or have someone lined up thats cheaper, better and younger than the one you're selling.

 

 

In the case of Milner it was good financial business for Ashley and nothing else.

 

Did you think selling Woodgate was good business?

 

Yes but only because at the time anyone we had sitting in the wings would play more games than he was doing.

 

But we sold our best defender and didn't replace him until January, compare that to the Summer where we had Jonas and Geremi who I'd play over Milner and i can't see how one can be good business and the other not.

Oversimplifies things a bit though. For one thing I'd go with Milner ahead of Geremi but even allowing for Jonas being better we've got a small squad and we lost in Milner a decent player, who is also pretty versatile (I think the lad's ordinary, don't get me wrong) and he also has a very good attitude in terms of workrate and seemingly not minding playing in different positions. A player like that was valuable to our team (and still would be) because of the small squad we have. A quick look at the bench for games this season gives me serious concerns, especially given the bad start we've now had.

 

Well tbh I think 4 wingers is enough for any squad and I don't have a problem with going into the season with Jonas, Geremi, Duff and N'Zogbia as wide men, I would have been happy to have Jonas as Milner's replacement and spent the money on a decent replacement for Butt.

 

Not really interested in attitude and workrate because he's slow and can't cross.

[Guest alex]

You can, aye. Basically it falls down to who you trust. I trust Keegan, you trust Ashley in other words.

 

And thats the magic statement, but I have to say even taking Keegan out of the equation, theres nothing been said or done by Ashley, Wise or the rest to give you any kind of trust in them. If anyone can give me a statement that Ashley has made in the last year that can be proved to be true then I'd be interested to see it.

 

You see I think Keegan has been feeding the press all Summer long about what was going on behind the scenes which is why they were so sure of what they were writing, I also think he's been proven to be a liar by making out everything was alright to the fans while having off the record chats with Louise Taylor and co.

That's exactly what Chez reckons.

It's pure supposition again though. Although it's funny how you see an idea someone has come up with as proof someone is a liar yet aren't as critical about the regime making public statements that were contradictory. Agendas and all that, eh?

[Baggio 0]

I also think he's been proven to be a liar by making out everything was alright to the fans while having off the record chats with Louise Taylor and co.

 

...so daft

what did you want him to do come out and slate the board and everyone else in a tv interview?

 

fuck sake whether it was ok or not he prob was trying to do best he behind the scenes while maybe leaking the odd bit to the press thinking he force things to better or get something rolling, bit of pressure on Ashley and co

till the transfer window closed, he seen the squad and how his requests had been ignored and had to take different action

 

So it's alright to lie as long as you've got good intentions?

 

I wonder if the people who were debating signing up for a 3 year deal but decided too because of what Keegan was saying are happy he told them lies?

[Guest alex]

In footballing terms its only a good piece of business if you either already have replacements sitting there ie a pool of talent in the wings or have someone lined up thats cheaper, better and younger than the one you're selling.

 

 

In the case of Milner it was good financial business for Ashley and nothing else.

 

Did you think selling Woodgate was good business?

 

Yes but only because at the time anyone we had sitting in the wings would play more games than he was doing.

 

But we sold our best defender and didn't replace him until January, compare that to the Summer where we had Jonas and Geremi who I'd play over Milner and i can't see how one can be good business and the other not.

Oversimplifies things a bit though. For one thing I'd go with Milner ahead of Geremi but even allowing for Jonas being better we've got a small squad and we lost in Milner a decent player, who is also pretty versatile (I think the lad's ordinary, don't get me wrong) and he also has a very good attitude in terms of workrate and seemingly not minding playing in different positions. A player like that was valuable to our team (and still would be) because of the small squad we have. A quick look at the bench for games this season gives me serious concerns, especially given the bad start we've now had.

 

Well tbh I think 4 wingers is enough for any squad and I don't have a problem with going into the season with Jonas, Geremi, Duff and N'Zogbia as wide men, I would have been happy to have Jonas as Milner's replacement and spent the money on a decent replacement for Butt.

 

Not really interested in attitude and workrate because he's slow and can't cross.

Oversimplifies matters again though. Duff is practically perma-crocked (also shit and I'd have Milner in ahead of him) and N'Zogbia is cover for the LB position.

[Guest alex]

Ant, I was one of them because I had misplaced faith in the club and their promises and ability to get people in. I seem to remember a quote from the club (Ashley?) about signings being likely to be very late in the window and even on deadline day and I believed it. You were totally spot on though and I couldn't have been more wrong.

 

that wasn't a dig at you btw, didn't remember who it was and there was a fair number of posts along those lines.

 

i had faith deals might be done as well to be fair

i just thought they'd be last minute deals.... as opposed to well thought out early signings with time to gel/settle in like i had wanted.

 

that midfielder we have on loan is out till February it was reported.. i hope hes being sent back..

It was a dig at me you cunt

[Baggio 0]

You can, aye. Basically it falls down to who you trust. I trust Keegan, you trust Ashley in other words.

 

And thats the magic statement, but I have to say even taking Keegan out of the equation, theres nothing been said or done by Ashley, Wise or the rest to give you any kind of trust in them. If anyone can give me a statement that Ashley has made in the last year that can be proved to be true then I'd be interested to see it.

 

You see I think Keegan has been feeding the press all Summer long about what was going on behind the scenes which is why they were so sure of what they were writing, I also think he's been proven to be a liar by making out everything was alright to the fans while having off the record chats with Louise Taylor and co.

That's exactly what Chez reckons.

It's pure supposition again though. Although it's funny how you see an idea someone has come up with as proof someone is a liar yet aren't as critical about the regime making public statements that were contradictory. Agendas and all that, eh?

 

I never said it was proof, I said it's what I think.

 

I've also said I don't know why they didn't come out and say what Wise's role was.

[Guest alex]

I also think he's been proven to be a liar by making out everything was alright to the fans while having off the record chats with Louise Taylor and co.

 

...so daft

what did you want him to do come out and slate the board and everyone else in a tv interview?

 

fuck sake whether it was ok or not he prob was trying to do best he behind the scenes while maybe leaking the odd bit to the press thinking he force things to better or get something rolling, bit of pressure on Ashley and co

till the transfer window closed, he seen the squad and how his requests had been ignored and had to take different action

 

So it's alright to lie as long as you've got good intentions?

 

I wonder if the people who were debating signing up for a 3 year deal but decided too because of what Keegan was saying are happy he told them lies?

I (like many others I'd say) signed up (with some misgivings about Ashley's intentions) because it was either that or face a large price increase if we didn't.

[trophyshy 7073]

Wise is a cunt, are we all agreed on that at least?

[Guest alex]

You can, aye. Basically it falls down to who you trust. I trust Keegan, you trust Ashley in other words.

 

And thats the magic statement, but I have to say even taking Keegan out of the equation, theres nothing been said or done by Ashley, Wise or the rest to give you any kind of trust in them. If anyone can give me a statement that Ashley has made in the last year that can be proved to be true then I'd be interested to see it.

 

You see I think Keegan has been feeding the press all Summer long about what was going on behind the scenes which is why they were so sure of what they were writing, I also think he's been proven to be a liar by making out everything was alright to the fans while having off the record chats with Louise Taylor and co.

That's exactly what Chez reckons.

It's pure supposition again though. Although it's funny how you see an idea someone has come up with as proof someone is a liar yet aren't as critical about the regime making public statements that were contradictory. Agendas and all that, eh?

 

I never said it was proof, I said it's what I think.

 

I've also said I don't know why they didn't come out and say what Wise's role was.

You've just wrote "I also think he's been proven to be a liar by making out everything was alright to the fans while having off the record chats with Louise Taylor and co." Are you now splitting hairs between not saying something is proof and saying you thought something was proven? Sums you up tbh.

[Baggio 0]

In footballing terms its only a good piece of business if you either already have replacements sitting there ie a pool of talent in the wings or have someone lined up thats cheaper, better and younger than the one you're selling.

 

 

In the case of Milner it was good financial business for Ashley and nothing else.

 

Did you think selling Woodgate was good business?

 

Yes but only because at the time anyone we had sitting in the wings would play more games than he was doing.

 

But we sold our best defender and didn't replace him until January, compare that to the Summer where we had Jonas and Geremi who I'd play over Milner and i can't see how one can be good business and the other not.

Oversimplifies things a bit though. For one thing I'd go with Milner ahead of Geremi but even allowing for Jonas being better we've got a small squad and we lost in Milner a decent player, who is also pretty versatile (I think the lad's ordinary, don't get me wrong) and he also has a very good attitude in terms of workrate and seemingly not minding playing in different positions. A player like that was valuable to our team (and still would be) because of the small squad we have. A quick look at the bench for games this season gives me serious concerns, especially given the bad start we've now had.

 

Well tbh I think 4 wingers is enough for any squad and I don't have a problem with going into the season with Jonas, Geremi, Duff and N'Zogbia as wide men, I would have been happy to have Jonas as Milner's replacement and spent the money on a decent replacement for Butt.

 

Not really interested in attitude and workrate because he's slow and can't cross.

Oversimplifies matters again though. Duff is practically perma-crocked (also shit and I'd have Milner in ahead of him) and N'Zogbia is cover for the LB position.

 

I don't think N'Zogbia was left back cover, the club wanted a left back and for some reason Atouba didn't bother coming over the day before the window closed.

 

It's not worth going around in circles because we won't agree, it'll be interesting to see your opinion come the January transfer window if Keegan is back by then under new owners and whether you're so critical if players we need in positions don't arrive.

[Baggio 0]

You can, aye. Basically it falls down to who you trust. I trust Keegan, you trust Ashley in other words.

 

And thats the magic statement, but I have to say even taking Keegan out of the equation, theres nothing been said or done by Ashley, Wise or the rest to give you any kind of trust in them. If anyone can give me a statement that Ashley has made in the last year that can be proved to be true then I'd be interested to see it.

 

You see I think Keegan has been feeding the press all Summer long about what was going on behind the scenes which is why they were so sure of what they were writing, I also think he's been proven to be a liar by making out everything was alright to the fans while having off the record chats with Louise Taylor and co.

That's exactly what Chez reckons.

It's pure supposition again though. Although it's funny how you see an idea someone has come up with as proof someone is a liar yet aren't as critical about the regime making public statements that were contradictory. Agendas and all that, eh?

 

I never said it was proof, I said it's what I think.

 

I've also said I don't know why they didn't come out and say what Wise's role was.

You've just wrote "I also think he's been proven to be a liar by making out everything was alright to the fans while having off the record chats with Louise Taylor and co." Are you now splitting hairs between not saying something is proof and saying you thought something was proven? Sums you up tbh.

 

I'm saying I've given my opinion rather than saying it's proof that can't be disputed, I've already said none of us know whats gone on.

[LeazesMag 0]

Wise is a cunt, are we all agreed on that at least?

 

apart from Baggy who seems hell bent on avoiding admitting that he's been made to look a right arsehole hence the lack of response to me

[Guest alex]

In footballing terms its only a good piece of business if you either already have replacements sitting there ie a pool of talent in the wings or have someone lined up thats cheaper, better and younger than the one you're selling.

 

 

In the case of Milner it was good financial business for Ashley and nothing else.

 

Did you think selling Woodgate was good business?

 

Yes but only because at the time anyone we had sitting in the wings would play more games than he was doing.

 

But we sold our best defender and didn't replace him until January, compare that to the Summer where we had Jonas and Geremi who I'd play over Milner and i can't see how one can be good business and the other not.

Oversimplifies things a bit though. For one thing I'd go with Milner ahead of Geremi but even allowing for Jonas being better we've got a small squad and we lost in Milner a decent player, who is also pretty versatile (I think the lad's ordinary, don't get me wrong) and he also has a very good attitude in terms of workrate and seemingly not minding playing in different positions. A player like that was valuable to our team (and still would be) because of the small squad we have. A quick look at the bench for games this season gives me serious concerns, especially given the bad start we've now had.

 

Well tbh I think 4 wingers is enough for any squad and I don't have a problem with going into the season with Jonas, Geremi, Duff and N'Zogbia as wide men, I would have been happy to have Jonas as Milner's replacement and spent the money on a decent replacement for Butt.

 

Not really interested in attitude and workrate because he's slow and can't cross.

Oversimplifies matters again though. Duff is practically perma-crocked (also shit and I'd have Milner in ahead of him) and N'Zogbia is cover for the LB position.

 

I don't think N'Zogbia was left back cover, the club wanted a left back and for some reason Atouba didn't bother coming over the day before the window closed.

 

It's not worth going around in circles because we won't agree, it'll be interesting to see your opinion come the January transfer window if Keegan is back by then under new owners and whether you're so critical if players we need in positions don't arrive.

N'Zogbia turned out to be left-back cover and going off what you've said already about what was happening just prior to the window closing I can only assume Wise and Co. are to blame for Atouba not coming, or do you want to have it both ways and say KK didn't give him his seal of approval?

I'll leave commenting on Keegan's / the new owner's failings in the next transfer window until they happen if that's ok.

[Guest alex]

You can, aye. Basically it falls down to who you trust. I trust Keegan, you trust Ashley in other words.

 

And thats the magic statement, but I have to say even taking Keegan out of the equation, theres nothing been said or done by Ashley, Wise or the rest to give you any kind of trust in them. If anyone can give me a statement that Ashley has made in the last year that can be proved to be true then I'd be interested to see it.

 

You see I think Keegan has been feeding the press all Summer long about what was going on behind the scenes which is why they were so sure of what they were writing, I also think he's been proven to be a liar by making out everything was alright to the fans while having off the record chats with Louise Taylor and co.

That's exactly what Chez reckons.

It's pure supposition again though. Although it's funny how you see an idea someone has come up with as proof someone is a liar yet aren't as critical about the regime making public statements that were contradictory. Agendas and all that, eh?

 

I never said it was proof, I said it's what I think.

 

I've also said I don't know why they didn't come out and say what Wise's role was.

You've just wrote "I also think he's been proven to be a liar by making out everything was alright to the fans while having off the record chats with Louise Taylor and co." Are you now splitting hairs between not saying something is proof and saying you thought something was proven? Sums you up tbh.

 

I'm saying I've given my opinion rather than saying it's proof that can't be disputed, I've already said none of us know whats gone on.

Which is exactly my point. See the bit in bold above, especially the second bit.

Edited October 7, 2008 by alex

[Baggio 0]

So it's alright to lie as long as you've got good intentions?

I wonder if the people who were debating signing up for a 3 year deal but decided too because of what Keegan was saying are happy he told them lies?

 

your quite right he should've shot himself in the foot with no doubt some form of non disclosure agreement that he had to sign

(the type anyone with an ounce of sense makes you sign when taking over positions like that)

cost himself millions of pounds opened himself up to lawsuits and a proper reason for dismissal

 

don't be daft, how many managers or bosses or administrators of any club or major business have you seen ever come out and reveal all the problems going on

 

Benitez seems happy to come out and say if there's a problem, most keep their mouth shut though rather than painting a picture that isn't true.

[Baggio 0]

Wise is a cunt, are we all agreed on that at least?

 

apart from Baggy who seems hell bent on avoiding admitting that he's been made to look a right arsehole hence the lack of response to me

 

I don't reply to you because I'll never get rid of you if I do.

[Baggio 0]

In footballing terms its only a good piece of business if you either already have replacements sitting there ie a pool of talent in the wings or have someone lined up thats cheaper, better and younger than the one you're selling.

 

 

In the case of Milner it was good financial business for Ashley and nothing else.

 

Did you think selling Woodgate was good business?

 

Yes but only because at the time anyone we had sitting in the wings would play more games than he was doing.

 

But we sold our best defender and didn't replace him until January, compare that to the Summer where we had Jonas and Geremi who I'd play over Milner and i can't see how one can be good business and the other not.

Oversimplifies things a bit though. For one thing I'd go with Milner ahead of Geremi but even allowing for Jonas being better we've got a small squad and we lost in Milner a decent player, who is also pretty versatile (I think the lad's ordinary, don't get me wrong) and he also has a very good attitude in terms of workrate and seemingly not minding playing in different positions. A player like that was valuable to our team (and still would be) because of the small squad we have. A quick look at the bench for games this season gives me serious concerns, especially given the bad start we've now had.

 

Well tbh I think 4 wingers is enough for any squad and I don't have a problem with going into the season with Jonas, Geremi, Duff and N'Zogbia as wide men, I would have been happy to have Jonas as Milner's replacement and spent the money on a decent replacement for Butt.

 

Not really interested in attitude and workrate because he's slow and can't cross.

Oversimplifies matters again though. Duff is practically perma-crocked (also shit and I'd have Milner in ahead of him) and N'Zogbia is cover for the LB position.

 

I don't think N'Zogbia was left back cover, the club wanted a left back and for some reason Atouba didn't bother coming over the day before the window closed.

 

It's not worth going around in circles because we won't agree, it'll be interesting to see your opinion come the January transfer window if Keegan is back by then under new owners and whether you're so critical if players we need in positions don't arrive.

N'Zogbia turned out to be left-back cover and going off what you've said already about what was happening just prior to the window closing I can only assume Wise and Co. are to blame for Atouba not coming, or do you want to have it both ways and say KK didn't give him his seal of approval?

I'll leave commenting on Keegan's / the new owner's failings in the next transfer window until they happen if that's ok.

 

I don't know why Atouba didn't come, all the Hamburg official site said was he turned up at training instead of coming here for a medical, no reason was given why.

 

I'll keep an eye out for your opinion in January if Keegan comes back, could be interesting.

[Guest alex]

So it's alright to lie as long as you've got good intentions?

I wonder if the people who were debating signing up for a 3 year deal but decided too because of what Keegan was saying are happy he told them lies?

 

your quite right he should've shot himself in the foot with no doubt some form of non disclosure agreement that he had to sign

(the type anyone with an ounce of sense makes you sign when taking over positions like that)

cost himself millions of pounds opened himself up to lawsuits and a proper reason for dismissal

 

don't be daft, how many managers or bosses or administrators of any club or major business have you seen ever come out and reveal all the problems going on

 

Benitez seems happy to come out and say if there's a problem, most keep their mouth shut though rather than painting a picture that isn't true.

I really don't understand your viewpoint. As I've already pointed out the only people we know who have lied are the club heirarchy owner yet you seem to be defending them to the hilt (you've already said you thionk Ashley's one mistake was appointing KK).

[LeazesMag 0]

Wise is a cunt, are we all agreed on that at least?

 

apart from Baggy who seems hell bent on avoiding admitting that he's been made to look a right arsehole hence the lack of response to me

 

I don't reply to you because I'll never get rid of you if I do.

 

hell bent on not admitting you spouted bollocks you mean