The F1 2008 thread

[Meenzer 15877]

OK then, I'll revise that to "All sports should take advice consisting of ideas they've already come up with".

[Fop 1]

OK then, I'll revise that to "All sports should take advice consisting of ideas they've already come up with".

If they'd listen to me they'd have come up with it years ago.

 

(and my implementation would actually have an effect, if only more spectacular crashes , we'll have to see about this "boost" button).

[Jimbo 175]

Personally I think they should allow limited nitros boosts for each car

 

For 2009, the FIA has introduced another series of changes to spice up the sport.

 

These include introducing a "boost" button to provide a brief burst of extra power and changes to the aerodynamics to make it easier for one car to follow another closely.

 

Gosh. It's almost like the authorities got something right for once.

 

Spikes on the wheels next, I tell thee.

[Ketsbaia 0]

Fop in another uneducated post shocker. Of course, he wouldn't have had to stoop to that level if he'd watched the GP at the weekend.

 

So in 2009 we're going to have boost buttons, BBC, no TC, slicks and new aerodynamic packages? Sounds good

[Fop 1]

Fop in another uneducated post shocker. Of course, he wouldn't have had to stoop to that level if he'd watched the GP at the weekend.

 

Ketsbaia in completely bigoted, prejudiced and (as usual) utterly wrong post non-shocker.

 

Stick to the more general hate, it's harder to for you to end up looking quite so much a fool.

 

 

So in 2009 we're going to have boost buttons, BBC, no TC, slicks and new aerodynamic packages? Sounds good

 

We'll see, implementation can ruin the best ideas (even mine ).

[The Fish 11112]

Dull tv after the first corner.

[Dr Kenneth Noisewater 0]

McLaren drivers punished for dawdling on the racing line:

 

McLaren duo Lewis Hamilton and Heikki Kovalainen have been penalised five grid places for impeding rivals during qualifying at the Malaysian Grand Prix.

 

The pair had been on the second row but Hamilton will now start in ninth, one place behind his Finnish team-mate.

 

After qualifying they were summoned by the stewards to answer complaints they held others up in the last session.

 

They ruled Kovalainen blocked Renault driver Fernando Alonso and Hamilton had obstructed BMW Sauber's Nick Heidfeld.

 

The FIA said Hamilton was "travelling at a very slow speed on the racing line", while Kovalainen was also charged with committing the same offence against Alonso.

 

Hamilton and Kovalainen had completed their fast laps and were slowing down to conserve fuel.

 

But Heidfeld complained their actions had cost him vital seconds in the final qualifying session, when 10 drivers go all out for the top grid positions.

 

"Most of the cars were already very slow when I was on my flying lap, just like they were parked on the circuit," he said.

 

"Both of the McLarens were in front at turn four, in the middle of the racing line.

 

"I just couldn't drive on the line that I wanted and, even more importantly, I could not brake where I wanted to.

 

"If you look at the times, they were very, very close - I lost two tenths and I think that would have put me third."

 

Hamilton felt he was not at fault, although did apologise to Heidfeld.

 

"I was pretty much out of the way," he said after emerging from the stewards' meeting. "If I held him up then I apologise for that."

 

Alonso, who left McLaren after a turbulent season to rejoin Renault, also felt he was denied a quick lap by the McLarens.

 

"I could have done better in Q3 this afternoon as I was with Heidfeld on a fast lap while the others were going slowly, and that affected me a bit, which is a shame," the double world champion said.

 

However, the McLaren team defended their drivers and insisted they had done all they could to make sure their rivals were able to cleanly complete their flying laps.

 

"There was clearly an issue there and it's unfortunate," chief executive Martin Whitmarsh said.

 

"If you look at the footage, our guys squeezed in as much as they could and slowed and we don't think they impaired Nick.

 

"I can understand his view that having all of those cars around when you're trying to concentrate on a quick lap isn't ideal."

 

McLaren accepted their punishment and said in a statement: "We accept the stewards' decision but would like to add that neither Lewis nor Heikki impaired any of their competitors deliberately."

 

Heidfeld was still not happy to accept their explanation and said: "If they did the best that they could do, they didn't do very well.

 

"I was approaching my last lap on the option tyre and it would have been my quickest lap if not for the McLarens driving in the middle of the racing line at 80kph."

 

1. Felipe Massa (Brazil) Ferrari 1:35.748

2. Kimi Raikkonen (Finland) Ferrari 1:36.230

3. Jarno Trulli (Italy) Toyota 1:36.711

4. Robert Kubica (Poland) BMW Sauber 1:36.727

5. Nick Heidfeld (Germany) BMW Sauber 1:36.753

6. Mark Webber (Australia) Red Bull 1:37.009

7. Fernando Alonso (Spain) Renault 1:38.450

8. Heikki Kovalainen (Finland) McLaren 1:36.613 *

9. Lewis Hamilton (Britain) McLaren 1:36.709 *

10. Timo Glock (Germany) Toyota 1:39.656

11. Jenson Button (Britain) Honda 1:35.208

12. David Coulthard (Britain) Red Bull 1:35.408

13. Nelson Piquet (Brazil) Renault 1:35.562

14. Rubens Barrichello (Brazil) Honda 1:35.622

15. Sebastian Vettel (Germany) Toro Rosso 1:35.648

16. Nico Rosberg (Germany) Williams 1:35.670

17. Giancarlo Fisichella (Italy) Force India 1:36.240

18. Kazuki Nakajima (Japan) Williams 1:36.388

19. Sebastien Bourdais (France) Toro Rosso 1:36.677

20. Takuma Sato (Japan) Super Aguri 1:37.087

21. Adrian Sutil (Germany) Force India 1:37.101

22. Anthony Davidson (Britain) Super Aguri 1:37.481

 

* demoted five places for impeding

[Ketsbaia 0]

I'm utterly, utterly bemused by that penalty, like. I was daft enough to get up to watch the qualifying live and every car on the track at the time impeded those two, Massa probably being the worst placed out of the lot. Not denying the McLaren's got in the way but they weren't the only ones.

 

The FIA setting themselves up for another joke season perhaps?

Edited March 23, 2008 by Ketsbaia

[Fop 1]

The FIA setting themselves up for another joke season perhaps?

Ferrari's car for next season apparently:

[Craig 6703]

Word is that Richard Hammond is going to present F1 when it returns to BBC. Not quite sure how I feel about that....

 

I love the Top Gear humour and I love the subtle comedy that has always been prevelent within F1 (the Brundle comments for instance) but I'm not quite sure I want to see Top gear humour in F1 coverage.

[Dr Kenneth Noisewater 0]

I love the Top Gear humour and I love the subtle comedy that has always been prevelent within F1 (the Brundle comments for instance) but I'm not quite sure I want to see Top gear humour in F1 coverage.

I'd tend to agree with that. The Beeb have got an idea that the appeal of Top Gear now extends beyond petrolheads, and want to try the same trick with F1.

 

I see Alonso is issuing a come-and-get-me to Ferrari. How's that going to work out? Kimi and Massa are both under contract for 2009 and even if Massa was pushed out, why would it work any better than Alonso/Hamilton? He's already proved he can't handle an elite team mate given equal status.

[trophyshy 7103]

Go Fiddy, like its your birthday!

[Craig 6703]

I love the Top Gear humour and I love the subtle comedy that has always been prevelent within F1 (the Brundle comments for instance) but I'm not quite sure I want to see Top gear humour in F1 coverage.

I'd tend to agree with that. The Beeb have got an idea that the appeal of Top Gear now extends beyond petrolheads, and want to try the same trick with F1.

 

I see Alonso is issuing a come-and-get-me to Ferrari. How's that going to work out? Kimi and Massa are both under contract for 2009 and even if Massa was pushed out, why would it work any better than Alonso/Hamilton? He's already proved he can't handle an elite team mate given equal status.

 

Alonso acting like the spoiled kid in the sweet shop demanding he gets what he wants? Surely not...

 

tbh I think the Ferrari deal is already done... and I think you're going to be surprised dr ken - I think 'muttley' will stay....

[Fop 1]

I love the Top Gear humour and I love the subtle comedy that has always been prevelent within F1 (the Brundle comments for instance) but I'm not quite sure I want to see Top gear humour in F1 coverage.

I'd tend to agree with that. The Beeb have got an idea that the appeal of Top Gear now extends beyond petrolheads, and want to try the same trick with F1.

 

 

Not sure it'll really work with F1, well unless they make the cars tow caravans or something.

[Happy Face 29]

Hamilton suffers crash in Bahrain

 

Lewis Hamilton suffered a major crash to compound a miserable day in Bahrain as Ferrari pair Felipe Massa and Kimi Raikkonen dominated Friday practice.

 

The Briton ran off the track and into a barrier during the second session but was unharmed ahead of Sunday's race.

 

The 23-year-old finished both sessions as fourth fastest, over a second and a half down on his rivals' lap times.

 

Massa was quickest, posting a lap of one minute, 31.420 seconds, with team-mate Raikkonen a close second.

 

Hamilton's crash into a tyre wall occurred with just over nine minutes of the second practice session at the Sakhir circuit remaining.

 

The current world championship leader appeared to lose traction coming out of a series of swift turns, which led to him locking up and sliding across a run-off area and into the barrier with considerable force.

 

After a few moments to compose himself, Hamilton emerged from his badly damaged car apparently unharmed.

 

He was then taken back to the McLaren garage on the back of a motorbike, while his car was craned onto the back of a truck and returned to the pits for repairs.

 

"I made a mistake. I got caught out by the kerb and it spun me around - that kerb it is quite spiteful," said the Briton, who suffered severely bruised ribs after ploughing nose first into a tyre wall at the Nurburgring in qualifying for last year's European Grand Prix.

 

Ferrari are very quick again as always, but we are close

 

Lewis Hamilton

 

"If you hit the wrong part of it is spits you off because the barrier is quite close to the side of the track. That's racing. It won't happen again.

 

"There is no impact on the weekend. There are no bruises to report from me and we completed most of the session, making some good steps forward.

 

"Ferrari look very quick, but you don't know what fuel loads they are on. I'm hoping that fuel corrected it is a lot closer than things seem.

 

"Ferrari did a good job in the last race but we just have to focus on our own work. Pace-wise I feel quite comfortable and we saw from Malaysia that we have the pace to run with them in the race."

 

Brazilian Massa will hope to continue his fine form over the weekend after failing to score any points in the first two races.

 

"I like the track, I always go very well here," Massa, who won from pole to flag here last year, said.

 

"Hopefully I can say the same thing on Sunday. I think, considering that I still have zero points, a podium will definitely be a good result.

 

 

Massa has yet to score a point in this season's championship

 

"But sure if we can fight for a win and bring 10 points home it will be better. Let's just get the best weekend we can.

 

"For sure it will be quite competitive, me and Kimi like always, and we need to look forward that we started in the right direction and the base looks good for the weekend."

 

Reigning champion Raikkonen is likely to push his team-mate all weekend after an impressive practice, apart from one brief excursion off the track when he drifted wide at the final corner.

 

And it would all appear to indicate a tough weekend for the McLarens of Hamilton and Heikki Kovalainen - who ended second practice third in 1:32.752 - especially with the likes of Williams, BMW Sauber and Red Bull also looking in good pace.

 

Elsewhere, Williams's Nico Rosberg posted the third fastest time in first practice, although he slipped to sixth in the second, while his Japanese team-mate Kazuki Nakajima finished sixth then eighth.

 

Robert Kubica looked competitive in his BMW with a fastest time of 1:32.915, while Red Bull's Scot David Coulthard also showed cause for optimism with a quickest lap of 1:33.048.

 

The day was less productive for the likes of Briton Jenson Button and former world champion Fernando Alonso, who ended second practice 11th and 12th respectively, although the latter would have been higher had he not been impeded by Adrian Sutil on his final lap.

 

"Obviously we are not very competitive and we need to work overnight to change everything, because we are not very happy," said the Spaniard.

 

"We are obviously too slow so it is not easy to know where we are losing all the time. I am afraid it is just the car not suiting this track."

 

 

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Times from first practice at Bahrain International Circuit for Bahrain Grand Prix:

 

1. Felipe Massa (Bra) Ferrari one minute, 32.233 seconds

2. Kimi Raikkonen (Fin) Ferrari 1:32.350

3. Nico Rosberg (Ger) Williams 1:32.415

4. Lewis Hamilton (GB) McLaren 1:32.705

5. Heikki Kovalainen (Fin) McLaren 1:32.868

6. Kazuki Nakajima (Jpn) Williams 1:33.121

7. Robert Kubica (Pol) BMW Sauber 1:33.333

8. Jarno Trulli (Ita) Toyota 1:33.539

9. David Coulthard (GB) Red Bull 1:33.788

10. Fernando Alonso (Spa) Renault 1:33.815

11. Timo Glock (Ger) Toyota 1:33.929

12. Mark Webber (Aus) Red Bull 1:33.950

13. Nelson Piquet Jr (Bra) Renault 1:33.981

14. Nick Heidfeld (Ger) BMW Sauber 1:34.106

15. Sebastien Bourdais (Fra) Toro Rosso 1:34.235

16. Sebastian Vettel (Ger) Toro Rosso 1:34.321

17. Giancarlo Fisichella (Ita) Force India 1:34.862

18. Jenson Button (GB) Honda 1:34.915

19. Rubens Barrichello (Bra) Honda 1:35.174

20. Adrian Sutil (Ger) Force India 1:35.429

21. Anthony Davidson (GB) Super Aguri 1:36.145

22. Takuma Sato (Jpn) Super Aguri 1:36.536

 

Second practice times:

 

1. Felipe Massa (Bra) Ferrari 1:31.420

2. Kimi Raikkonen (Fin) Ferrari 1:32.327

3. Heikki Kovalainen (Fin) McLaren 1:32.752

4. Lewis Hamilton (GB) McLaren 1:32.847

5. Robert Kubica (Pol) BMW Sauber 1:32.915

6. Nico Rosberg (Ger) Williams 1:33.022

7. David Coulthard (GB) Red Bull 1:33.048

8. Kazuki Nakajima (Jap) Williams 1:33.098

9. Sebastien Bourdais (Fra) Toro Rosso 1:33.197

10. Nelson Piquet Jr (Bra) Renault 1:33.247

11. Jenson Button (GB) Honda 1:33.710

12. Fernando Alonso (Spa) Renault 1:33.755

13. Mark Webber (Aus) Red Bull 1:33.782

14. Jarno Trulli (Ita) Toyota 1:33.822

15. Timo Glock (Ger) Toyota 1:33.856

16. Rubens Barrichello (Bra) Honda 1:33.966

17. Nick Heidfeld (Ger) BMW Sauber 1:34.023

18. Giancarlo Fisichella (Ita) Force India 1:34.388

19. Adrian Sutil (Ger) Force India 1:34.405

20. Sebastian Vettel (Ger) Toro Rosso 1:34.787

21. Takuma Sato (Jap) Super Aguri 1:35.288

22. Anthony Davidson (GB) Super Aguri 1:35.712

[Dr Kenneth Noisewater 0]

Maiden F1 pole for Kubica, BMW in Bahrain

By Matt Beer

 

Robert Kubica took his and BMW Sauber's first Formula One pole position with a stunning lap in qualifying for the Bahrain Grand Prix.

 

The Pole beat favourite Felipe Massa (Ferrari), who had dominated Friday practice, by 0.027 seconds.

 

McLaren's Lewis Hamilton and Ferrari's Kimi Raikkonen will share the second row.

 

Massa held provisional pole after the first flying laps of Q3, but only by 0.011 seconds over Kubica.

 

Hamilton then briefly beat both when he lapped in 1:33.292 on his second run, but the McLaren driver did not stay on top for long, as Kubica responded with a 1:33.096.

 

Although Massa's second lap was sufficient to reclaim the front row position from Hamilton, his time of 1:33.123 was not enough to beat the BMW driver to pole.

 

World champion Raikkonen could only manage fourth, three tenths of a second slower than teammate Massa. Heikki Kovalainen completed the top five in the second McLaren.

 

Kubica's teammate Nick Heidfeld was 0.7 seconds slower than the pole-sitter in sixth place for BMW.

 

Jarno Trulli (Toyota) and Nico Rosberg (Williams) will share the fourth row, Trulli having been second fastest in the first qualifying segment.

 

Jenson Button got Honda into the top ten for the first time this season, edging up to 10th in the final moments of Q2 and then securing ninth place, just ahead of Renault's Fernando Alonso. Button's teammate Rubens Barrichello will start 12th.

 

Red Bull Racing had a disappointing session. While Mark Webber missed out on a top ten spot by 0.009 seconds and will start 11th, while teammate David Coulthard blamed a straightforward lack of speed for his Q1 elimination after ending up 17th on the grid. He was 0.018 seconds away from making it through to Q2.

 

Timo Glock (Toyota), Nelson Piquet (Renault) and Kazuki Nakajima (Williams) could not match their respective teammates Trulli, Alonso and Rosberg, and were knocked out in Q2.

 

While Glock briefly made it up to ninth before other drivers' improvements pushed him back to 13th, Piquet and Nakajima's best efforts were only good enough for 14th and 16th.

 

Sebastien Bourdais out-qualified Toro Rosso teammate Sebastian Vettel for the first time and also made his first Q2 appearance. The Frenchman will start 15th, with Vettel only managing 19th.

 

Force India again failed to make it beyond Q1. Giancarlo Fisichella moved up to 18th with a last-gasp effort after abandoning his last flying lap following an error, while teammate Adrian Sutil was 20th.

 

The Super Aguris will fill the back row, with Anthony Davidson ahead of Takuma Sato for the first time this season.

 

The Japanese driver caused a brief red flag after spinning on the exit of the final corner, damaging his car's rear wing and suspension on the pit entry barrier.

 

1. Robert Kubica (Poland) BMW Sauber 1 min 33.096

2. Felipe Massa (Brazil) Ferrari 1:33.123

3. Lewis Hamilton (Britain) McLaren 1:33.292

4. Kimi Raikkonen (Finland) Ferrari 1:33.418

5. Heikki Kovalainen (Finland) McLaren 1:33.488

6. Nick Heidfeld (Germany) BMW Sauber 1:33.737

7. Jarno Trulli (Italy) Toyota 1:33.994

8. Nico Rosberg (Germany) Williams - Toyota 1:34.015

9. Jenson Button (Britain) Honda 1:35.057

10. Fernando Alonso (Spain) Renault 1:35.115

11. Mark Webber (Australia) RedBull - Renault 1:32.371

12. Rubens Barrichello (Brazil) Honda 1:32.508

13. Timo Glock (Germany) Toyota 1:32.528

14. Nelsinho Piquet (Brazil) Renault 1:32.790

15. Sebastien Bourdais (France) Toro Rosso - Ferrari 1:32.915

16. Kazuki Nakajima (Japan) Williams - Toyota 1:32.943

17. David Coulthard (Britain) RedBull - Renault 1:33.433

18. Giancarlo Fisichella (Italy) Force India - Ferrari 1:33.501

19. Sebastian Vettel (Germany) Toro Rosso - Ferrari 1:33.562

20. Adrian Sutil (Germany) Force India - Ferrari 1:33.845

21. Anthony Davidson (Britain) Super Aguri - Honda 1:34.140

22. Takuma Sato (Japan) Super Aguri - Honda 1:35.725

 

Massa messed up, he had the fastest car all the way through qualifying. Well done to Kubica on his first pole though.

[Dr Kenneth Noisewater 0]

Poor start from Hamilton dropped him into the pack. Coming up behind guess who... Alonso, he runs into the back of him.

 

Brake test? Or trying too hard?

Edited April 6, 2008 by Dr Kenneth Noisewater

[Meenzer 15877]

Poor start from Hamilton dropped him into the pack. Coming up behind guess who... Alonso, he runs into the back of him.

 

Brake test? Or trying too hard?

Depends if you're an ITV commentator or not. Alonso's already been tried and convicted by James and Martin's merry kangaroo court.

[Dr Kenneth Noisewater 0]

Poor start from Hamilton dropped him into the pack. Coming up behind guess who... Alonso, he runs into the back of him.

 

Brake test? Or trying too hard?

Depends if you're an ITV commentator or not. Alonso's already been tried and convicted by James and Martin's merry kangaroo court.

Some 'rookie mistakes' that we might have expected last season starting to creep in this year?

 

Also, does Coulthard need a booster cushion? That's two races running he's turned in on a car that was three quarters of the way past him. Maybe he can't see over the sides of the cockpit?

[Ketsbaia 0]

To me it looked like Alonso didn't get on the throttle as soon as he should've but then i'm biased.

[Dr Kenneth Noisewater 0]

Poor start from Hamilton dropped him into the pack. Coming up behind guess who... Alonso, he runs into the back of him.

 

Brake test? Or trying too hard?

Depends if you're an ITV commentator or not. Alonso's already been tried and convicted by James and Martin's merry kangaroo court.

Hamilton blaming himself, which knocks holes in 'The Cock's' theory.

[Dr Kenneth Noisewater 0]

One of the all-time greats died 40 years ago today:

Surtees remembers Clark 40 years on

By Steven English

 

 

Former world champion John Surtees today paid tribute to his former teammate Jim Clark, who died 40 years ago today.

 

Surtees and Clark drove for Lotus together in 1960, before Surtees left to drive for Cooper, Lola, and then Ferrari who he won the 1964 title with.

 

Clark, meanwhile, remained with Lotus throughout his career and won the world championship in 1963 and 1965. He was killed during a European Formula Two race at Hockenheim in 1968.

 

"There were no sides to him," Surtees told autosport.com. "He was a straightforward guy and an enthusiast that loved his driving. He was a great ambassador for the sport and you always knew you could compete with him honestly - you could race him closely and know what he was and wasn't going to do.

 

"I had a great dice with him at Goodwood in the first race I competed in, and after that Colin Chapman asked me to drive with him so I joined Jimmy there and we became quite close.

 

"He actually introduced me to my first wife. I was woken up by a lot of noise in the hotel at the Belgian Grand Prix and it was Jimmy and this girl dancing. He was actually my best man at our wedding."

 

Surtees left Lotus for Cooper at the end of the season and two the two were never teammates again in Formula One, although they remained friends as well as rivals.

 

"At the end of 1960, Colin Chapman offered me a position and asked who I'd want with me and I said Jimmy. I didn't stay at Lotus in the end because of a big argument involving Innes Ireland, otherwise it would have been myself and Jimmy at Lotus in 1961.

 

"When you joined a team like Ferrari in those days you isolated yourself quite a lot from the British contingent, so my relationship with Jim didn't develop after those early years, but we remained friends.

 

"We did the Tasman Series together one year and spent quite a lot of time white water rafting and messing about on jet boats. The cars kept falling apart so the racing wasn't much fun, but we still had a good time."

 

Clark's two titles sandwiched Surtees's win and the latter has ambivalent memories of their rivalry.

 

"Jimmy created a superb on-going relationship with Colin Chapman and Coventry Climax, then Ford Cosworth," added Surtees.

 

"They made a very strong combination and you didn't enjoy them as opponents, although you had to appreciate that it was something rather special. When something like that comes to an end in that fashion like that it's very sad.

 

"His death was a tragedy and there was all the uncertainty over whether it was his mistake, a tyre failure, or something else. I think it was some factor other than Jimmy, something definitely went wrong."

[Bombadil 0]

I'm surprised there's been no thread about Mosley!

[Craig 6703]

He's like James Allen.... best not spoken about...

[Dr Kenneth Noisewater 0]

Also, does Coulthard need a booster cushion? That's two races running he's turned in on a car that was three quarters of the way past him. Maybe he can't see over the sides of the cockpit?

Did it again apparently (I didn't see the incident).

 

Comfortable 1-2 for the Scuderia, nasty accident for Kovalainen.