The Attitude of the Players

[Guest Patrokles]

In my opinion, quite aside from tactics, etc. the attitude/motivation of the players has been our biggest weakness since the ending days of Robson. I personally think that Allardyce and perhaps the previous two incumbents have been massively handicapped by the willingness of the players to actually put a degree of effort in.

 

I have been as disappointed as anyone by Allardyce so far, but I can't help but feel that the players haven't bought into him at all, and it's this that is impacting performances. It's like he was facing a losing battle from the very start.

 

We even saw this in Robson's time; the raising of the game for the Arsenals, etc. There seems to be a culture amongst the players, regardless of who we've signed for the club, of disinterest and arrogance. Ironically, players like Dyer- who would be oft-cited as examples of such characteristics off the pitch- actually offered us something on the field. A lot of the current crop seem like decent enough people, but there can be no excuse for their lack of application.

 

It's easy to blame Allardyce, and cite the manager's job as including motivating the players, but this has been endemic to the club for a very long time. Shepherd talked about the lack of Rolls-Royce performances; the players got Robson sacked; we have witnessed countless inept displays over the years against 'lesser' sides.

 

It's interesting to wonder why this is. Talent-wise, we have a good bunch, and always have had. Often they genuinely seem to care, too, but for whatever reason cannot produce consistently good performances. Is it that there's just far too much pressure on them that it erodes confidence, do they just not care, has a culture of greed and disinterest permeated the entire club?

 

I suppose my point is that there is something rotten in the state of Newcastle and it has hindered numerous managers; a good number of whom had been previously successful. I am willing to give Allardyce time simply because his methods (whether you like them or not) require it. I think our players have some kind of massive psychological barriers to effective performance, and if they start buying into everything Allardyce has to offer, then maybe this will change- alternatively, we need to give him the time to replace those who have no interest in working for him.

 

This isn't to say I am happy with what he's done so far, btw. Also, I'm not intending this as an Allardyce thread, since we have those. I'm just baffled as to why for so many years, the players have been unable to perform effectively. I don't think it's as simple an answer as just 'management.'

[Guest alex]

Souness and Roeder were shite managers. Simple as that.

[Guest Patrokles]

Souness and Roeder were shite managers. Simple as that.

 

That doesn't necessarily explain the unwillingness/inability of the players to perform. Under Souness, for example, you'd at least expect some spirit. I think the players think they're bigger than the manager.

[Guest alex]

Souness and Roeder were shite managers. Simple as that.

 

That doesn't necessarily explain the unwillingness/inability of the players to perform. Under Souness, for example, you'd at least expect some spirit. I think the players think they're bigger than the manager.

I don't think Souness is particularly good at motivating players. He's just a bully which doesn't work any more given how much money players are on etc. My point is that, while a lot of players may be twats etc. a good manager knows how to motivate players and how to get the best out of them. I don't think Roeder could do that either.

[The Fish 11080]

watching those videos of Robson's reign reminded me that we never looked like a side who would accept defeat. Under Robson I can remember many occassions where we'd concede through sloppy Brambling at the back, but not really seem to lose any positivity in our attitude or style of play. Admittedly this had a lot to do with the impressive volume of match winners at our disposal. Players who can win a game from one dead ball situation.

 

Off the top of my head Robert, Solano, Shearer from a free kick, Speed, Shearer from a corner or Bellamy, Dyer from a moment of incredible pace or guile.

 

I look at our team now and struggle to see where (outside of Martins) the goals are going to come from. Because Even when Owen plays he needs supply, our wingers haven't the dead ball prowess so fereekicks and corners seem to be wasted.

 

Allardyce (and no I'm not trying to turn this into an Allardyce thread) needs to instil this self belief that fuelled the football under Robson.

[ewerk 31600]

I personally think that Allardyce and perhaps the previous two incumbents have been massively handicapped by the willingness of the players

 

a. One of the manager´s main roles is to motivate the team, if he can`t do that then he is failing in his job.

 

b. Allardyce brought in a lot of the players who have got us in this mess, if he can´t motivate them then he`s either made a mistake in signing them or they really disagree with his approach.

[Guest alex]

watching those videos of Robson's reign reminded me that we never looked like a side who would accept defeat. Under Robson I can remember many occassions where we'd concede through sloppy Brambling at the back, but not really seem to lose any positivity in our attitude or style of play. Admittedly this had a lot to do with the impressive volume of match winners at our disposal. Players who can win a game from one dead ball situation.

 

Off the top of my head Robert, Solano, Shearer from a free kick, Speed, Shearer from a corner or Bellamy, Dyer from a moment of incredible pace or guile.

 

I look at our team now and struggle to see where (outside of Martins) the goals are going to come from. Because Even when Owen plays he needs supply, our wingers haven't the dead ball prowess so fereekicks and corners seem to be wasted.

 

Allardyce (and no I'm not trying to turn this into an Allardyce thread) needs to instil this self belief that fuelled the football under Robson.

We just had a far better team and had pace, good strikers and a great footballer in Solano. All things the team currently lacks (I don't think any of our strikers are good enough for where we'd like to be - i.e. knocking on the door for a top 6 place).

[Guest Patrokles]

I personally think that Allardyce and perhaps the previous two incumbents have been massively handicapped by the willingness of the players

 

a. One of the manager´s main roles is to motivate the team, if he can`t do that then he is failing in his job.

 

b. Allardyce brought in a lot of the players who have got us in this mess, if he can´t motivate them then he`s either made a mistake in signing them or they really disagree with his approach.

 

a. "It's easy to blame Allardyce, and cite the manager's job as including motivating the players, but"

 

b. That's the thing. Why is it that a lot of the players who come here seem to lack hunger/motivation?

 

I suppose I should add that the mystery here is that Allardyce clearly had the ability to motivate his Bolton side, so he's not a poor motivator. To that end, you have to look to the players for answers.

Edited December 29, 2007 by Patrokles

[Jimbo 175]

I personally think that Allardyce and perhaps the previous two incumbents have been massively handicapped by the willingness of the players

 

a. One of the manager´s main roles is to motivate the team, if he can`t do that then he is failing in his job.

 

b. Allardyce brought in a lot of the players who have got us in this mess, if he can´t motivate them then he`s either made a mistake in signing them or they really disagree with his approach.

 

a. "It's easy to blame Allardyce, and cite the manager's job as including motivating the players, but"

 

b. That's the thing. Why is it that a lot of the players who come here seem to lack hunger/motivation?

 

I suppose I should add that the mystery here is that Allardyce clearly had the ability to motivate his Bolton side, so he's not a poor motivator. To that end, you have to look to the players for answers.

 

 

Thats the whole problem in my opinion, if the secret of successful management was that easy to pin-point the world would be full of brilliant managers.

[Happy Face 29]

I suppose I should add that the mystery here is that Allardyce clearly had the ability to motivate his Bolton side, so he's not a poor motivator. To that end, you have to look to the players for answers.

 

 

I don't think it's a mystery. What caught the eye with Bolton was how they'd be up for playing the top four. They consistently got freak results against them under Allardyce, but otherwise they played the same brand of uninspired football that grinds out a lower top half finish that he's brought to Newcastle.

 

It fits with Allardyce's ethos. That is, that you make sure you don't concede against the lower teams you fancy yourself against, on the assumption you'll score from a set piece at some point, but that you know you'll concede against better teams and "expect nothing" from them so you play like you have nothing to lose.