Dirk Kuyt and our "scouts"

[Phil K 0]

It has emerged that the scouts who had been watching Dirk Kuyt for years had at best been sitting on their hands while the lad went from strength to strength. We could have got him for a fraction of what they're asking for him now if they had knew their job, which clearly they didn't. It would seem as they were under the previous administartion of SBR, (he of the "Mick Wadsworth is a hugely talented coach" fame) they are elsewhere now. Who were they ?

[chip2388 0]

Didn't we already have a topic on this?

[Optimistic Nut 153]

I remember seeing something about this, but because we had Shearer, Bellamy, Lua-Lua, Ameobi, Cort and the emerging Chopra, he didn't see it worthwhile to spend £600,000 on a Dutch lad who probably wouldn't have had a look in.

[Phil K 0]

I remember seeing something about this, but because we had Shearer, Bellamy, Lua-Lua, Ameobi, Cort and the emerging Chopra, he didn't see it worthwhile to spend £600,000 on a Dutch lad who probably wouldn't have had a look in.

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I just wonder how many other examples are going to surface about the inadequacies of SBR's backroom staff.

[SCF_NUFC 0]

This is very harsh and the dutch phrase "the best captains always stand on the quay" seems applicable here. If Feyenoord bought the player for 600k three years ago, it was because he was not valued to be worth much more than that. I have always liked him as a player, but I am as amazed as everyone at his incredible progression in the last couple of seasons. At the time when Feyenoord got him, supporters from other clubs were laughing at us for signing him, much like people were laughing at Liverpool for signing Crouch. If Crouch proves to be a 20 goal a season striker in three years time and a first team international player for England, will you come back and open another topic about how poor the scouting is at St James? The fact of the matter is I am actually positively surprised that NUFC scouts knew about him as a player before everybody did. It makes a nice change from having to say "with all due respect, but we have never heard of player X" when talking about an established top quality player. Then there is the matter of taking the gamble and bringing a foreign player to the club. I don't think Kuijt would have broken in the Newcastle first team three years ago, and as a result I think he would not have been the player he is today would we have signed him three season's ago, so it's a non starter really.

[Souey's P45 0]

This is very harsh and the dutch phrase "the best captains always stand on the quay" seems applicable here. If Feyenoord bought the player for 600k three years ago, it was because he was not valued to be worth much more than that. I have always liked him as a player, but I am as amazed as everyone at his incredible progression in the last couple of seasons. At the time when Feyenoord got him, supporters from other clubs were laughing at us for signing him, much like people were laughing at Liverpool for signing Crouch. If Crouch proves to be a 20 goal a season striker in three years time and a first team international player for England, will you come back and open another topic about how poor the scouting is at St James? The fact of the matter is I am actually positively surprised that NUFC scouts knew about him as a player before everybody did. It makes a nice change from having to say "with all due respect, but we have never heard of player X" when talking about an established top quality player. Then there is the matter of taking the gamble and bringing a foreign player to the club. I don't think Kuijt would have broken in the Newcastle first team three years ago, and as a result I think he would not have been the player he is today would we have signed him three season's ago, so it's a non starter really.

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You Sir, are one of the sanest people on this forum!

 

Great post

[Optimistic Nut 153]

This is very harsh and the dutch phrase "the best captains always stand on the quay" seems applicable here. If Feyenoord bought the player for 600k three years ago, it was because he was not valued to be worth much more than that. I have always liked him as a player, but I am as amazed as everyone at his incredible progression in the last couple of seasons. At the time when Feyenoord got him, supporters from other clubs were laughing at us for signing him, much like people were laughing at Liverpool for signing Crouch. If Crouch proves to be a 20 goal a season striker in three years time and a first team international player for England, will you come back and open another topic about how poor the scouting is at St James? The fact of the matter is I am actually positively surprised that NUFC scouts knew about him as a player before everybody did. It makes a nice change from having to say "with all due respect, but we have never heard of player X" when talking about an established top quality player. Then there is the matter of taking the gamble and bringing a foreign player to the club. I don't think Kuijt would have broken in the Newcastle first team three years ago, and as a result I think he would not have been the player he is today would we have signed him three season's ago, so it's a non starter really.

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What a post.

 

Take a bow, Sir.

[Roland 0]

First, I agree with SCF_NUFC. Can remember myself saying 1.5 year that Kuyt woudl be a decent Feyenoord player but never make it in the PL. Now, he scored 30 goals and half the PL wants him in the team.

 

But Phil K is right about the scouting. Newcastle is now aiming at Kuijt, Owen and Anelka who are big names and at a good age. It would be fantastic if we would get that sort of player but everybody now is afraid that there will be no striker at 31 of August.

But it must be possible to find a striker at a smaller club, scout him during a season and at this summer buy one of those targets. In NL, PSV just loaned ( with a option to buy Koné). Huntelaar at Heerenveen is valued at 3/4 million pounds.

The NUFC scouts in NL surely know these players and likley there are a lot more in Germany, France, Scandanevia etc etc. Sometimes, I got the feeling that NUFC is only trying to get big names to SJP and thing will come ok after in stead of really building a team and improve it where needed.

 

Of course, getting a foreign player in or a player of a smaller club is a risk, but that is the task of the scouting system. Now, you gamble on getting expensive players and after that, making a team of it.

Edited August 29, 2005 by Roland

[geordieshandy 0]

They're trying to buy big name players because that makes Shepherd and Souness look good. He said himself that only proven quality is welcome at the gates of St James and therefore you have spend big money.

[Guest Sima]

This is very harsh and the dutch phrase "the best captains always stand on the quay" seems applicable here. If Feyenoord bought the player for 600k three years ago, it was because he was not valued to be worth much more than that. I have always liked him as a player, but I am as amazed as everyone at his incredible progression in the last couple of seasons. At the time when Feyenoord got him, supporters from other clubs were laughing at us for signing him, much like people were laughing at Liverpool for signing Crouch. If Crouch proves to be a 20 goal a season striker in three years time and a first team international player for England, will you come back and open another topic about how poor the scouting is at St James? The fact of the matter is I am actually positively surprised that NUFC scouts knew about him as a player before everybody did. It makes a nice change from having to say "with all due respect, but we have never heard of player X" when talking about an established top quality player. Then there is the matter of taking the gamble and bringing a foreign player to the club. I don't think Kuijt would have broken in the Newcastle first team three years ago, and as a result I think he would not have been the player he is today would we have signed him three season's ago, so it's a non starter really.

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Of course not because our coaching is frankly bollocks.

[SCF_NUFC 0]

Then there is the matter of taking the gamble and bringing a foreign player to the club. I don't think Kuijt would have broken in the Newcastle first team three years ago, and as a result I think he would not have been the player he is today would we have signed him three season's ago, so it's a non starter really.

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Of course not because our coaching is frankly bollocks.

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I think the primary reasonsibility for improving as a player lies with the player himself. Unfortunately, most players at NUFC do not seem to feel this urge. You may be right about the coaching staff, but I would have you note that not many clubs are actually that good at making talented players world class players. In England Arsenal spring to mind, but in general I believe it is more to do with the individual player's desire than coaching methods or personnel. My point about Kuijt was certainly not a disqualification of NUFC's coaching staff. After all, even Ronaldinho would look mediocre after three years of sitting on the bench. You would have to acknowledge that sometimes players develop better and faster as regular players in a league regarded as not a top league, than as squad players in top teams in top leagues?

 

Edit: BTW the news in the Dutch media this afternoon is that Kuijt has told the chairman and technical director of Feyenoord that he has decided that he is staying with Feyenoord for the remainder of this season. He says if a top club comes in for him, they are to tell them that they are welcome to come back at the end of the season. As a Feyenoord supporter I am very happy about this news, but as a Newcastle supporter it means another name can be taken off the list of viable prospects..

Edited August 29, 2005 by SCF_NUFC

[Isegrim 9780]

Then there is the matter of taking the gamble and bringing a foreign player to the club. I don't think Kuijt would have broken in the Newcastle first team three years ago, and as a result I think he would not have been the player he is today would we have signed him three season's ago, so it's a non starter really.

21119[/snapback]

 

Of course not because our coaching is frankly bollocks.

21250[/snapback]

 

I think the primary reasonsibility for improving as a player lies with the player himself. Unfortunately, most players at NUFC do not seem to feel this urge. You may be right about the coaching staff, but I would have you note that not many clubs are actually that good at making talented players world class players. In England Arsenal spring to mind, but in general I believe it is more to do with the individual player's desire than coaching methods or personnel. My point about Kuijt was certainly not a disqualification of NUFC's coaching staff. After all, even Ronaldinho would look mediocre after three years of sitting on the bench. You would have to acknowledge that sometimes players develop better and faster as regular players in a league regarded as not a top league, than as squad players in top teams in top leagues?

 

Edit: BTW the news in the Dutch media this afternoon is that Kuijt has told the chairman and technical director of Feyenoord that he has decided that he is staying with Feyenoord for the remainder of this season. He says if a top club comes in for him, they are to tell them that they are welcome to come back at the end of the season. As a Feyenoord supporter I am very happy about this news, but as a Newcastle supporter it means another name can be taken off the list of viable prospects..

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Nothing does help a player more than playing competitive matches. That is a bit of a problem with the reserve leagues. They do give match practise but can't be compared to competitive matches even at a lower level. Bernard did benefit from his loan spell at Darlington, so did Taylor at Wycombe. In fact I do think that if youngsters are not getting first team football they should get loaned out far more often.