NJS

Anyone mentioned how abysmal the ref was? Also Beagrie: "A monumental achievement" - monumental my arse. I'm still happy honest

A tribute to ignorance and bigotry - just what I'd expect.

The problem with the debates is the restrictive rules - not sure if there's a way around it that would generate a proper argument though - maybe they should get them all pissed on Stella and let them go at it.

Same for me really. Well the only time I ever swore at me dad I was about 7 or 8, I asked him if I could help him in the garden and he said no because it was dangerous with the lawn moor being on, and I called him a fuckin cunt, I don't even know where I got those words from, he smacked me hard and I never did it ever again. I was smacked and I don't think it's a bad thing really but I was very rarely smacked over that sort of age. I think my parents got it right. There shouldn't be legislation for it though ffs. I mean, any excessive smacking / hitting kids should come under existing laws anyway. Similar to the example you give, I don't think it's a bad deterrent to have in a parent's locker, so to speak. And you could just imagine kids threatening to phone the polis if they're going to get hit for doing something wrong. I can't remember being smacked but my Mam told me I was as a toddler which I guess is where my boundaries come from. I'm in two minds on the law angle - of course kids should have recourse to the authorities if parents go too far but I can see it causing problems as you say - theres a story at the moment about the head of Manchester council stepping down after his step-daughter called the police on him for what sounds like just a slap - though I think she's 16 or 17 so would fall into my general rule I still wouldn't prosecute for that if no real harm was done.

I keep getting leaflets from the liberals telling me only they can prevent a Tory victory in my seat - I looked at the figures from the last two elections and it's a blatant fucking lie (which they tried last time) but the boundaries have changed and it's now pretty much true. I'm loathe to vote Liberal but I'm actually starting to think of voting to get the Tory twat out - Its taken the thought of them actually getting into power to rekindle my hatred.

The get-out clause is that they've named one trader - he'll carry the carry if there is one and the management will escape as usual.

I would be the first to admit that despite my feelings on this subject, I've always found that there is a natural affinity between Geordies and Scousers - doesn't mean I like or trust them but it exists. Never had a problem with "proper" fans of any club though - including Londoners.

I've always thought an explained, controlled smack is fine for toddlers to teach things like not running out in the road but the idea of adults hitting kids who are above the age of about 8 is basically wrong.

Packaging the shit debt together knowing it was likely to fail is bad enough - collaborating with another firm who took a position on that failure is fucking blatant. I think they've relied for years on the fraud police not understanding the business - that's one thing that should be easy to fix.

It's ringing a bell with me from a comedy show with maybe a bishop character having a catchphrase along the lines of "I was taling to a man today" - Kenny Everett? Anyone remember?

Errr it was the bankers and financiers that left the country in the state it's in. Who removed restrictions from the bankers Yeah let's ignore responsibility of the public who embraced the credit card/buy to let culture which was the real cause - easier to blame the government.

At the last election I remember Blair being asked by a lass who said she was a socialist whether as such he had anything to offer her. His answer was basically "honestly - no" which though sad from my point of view actually stood out as being very honest. I think they should try it more often - then again I think now they are over-controlled and maybe by that stage Blair could be more open.

Same argument applies for most clubs - just as our players can live in nice areas in Northumberland, Liverpool players can join the druglords in Cheshire. I would also say that a lot of foreigners, even if they are typically thick footballers, are aware of the history in terms of trophies.

Merging what people are saying at work and what I've read, it looks like Cameron is suffering an anti-slime/smarm backlash which is good - I think its probably a big factor in the Tories not being as far ahead as they really should be.

Unfortunately the glory huntng wanks are worldwide which makes a difference in income and perceived prestige - otherwise I agree with you.

I tried to watch it but feared for my TV's life when Cameron started to speak so switched over.

"think and act like everyone else" "dictatorship" Oh the irony. I don't think 10 Hail Marys is a suitable punishment for the crimes somehow.

I still do not undrstand this Ameobi thing. The kid has scored some vital goals this season and made some to. He loves NUFC and is a local lad. He does not pick the team the managers do so he must warrant a place. Aye I agree he is not premier league standard but he has done a lot for us. I have nothing against him on a personal level - I just think he's an absolutley shit footballer. I consider the fact that he started the season as our main striker and will be just about that next season to completely epitomise how far the club has fallen. I think it speaks volumes that the only manager to see through him was Keegan - though I consider it a blemish against Bobby that he didn't.

Ameobi to be released/sold/put down for the good of humanity. Forest to fail in the play-offs Sheff Wed to be relegated Liverpool to miss out on the CL.

There has to be a difference bewteen idealistic ambition and reality. The thrust of LM's argument has always been right - we should expect to be a club that can challenge. Unfortunately apart from a forlorn hope that Ashley will dig deep, there is no source of the necessary money. Once you accept reality you can then talk about realistic ambitions to go with that - even allowing for West Brom and Forest/Whoever, I still think we will struggle to finish above a few teams next year having said that I think we should aim at a "Stoke" etc level but I think we'd be lucky to get there.

Probably said before: Classic Viz tip "Police: save time and arrest the weeping relative from the press conference - they always did it".

I think the problem is that even in a notionally secular country like the UK, people have been brought up to believe that criticising religion is beyond the pale if not completely taboo. I think a lot of people who haven't even considered the arguments find statements like "The God of the old testament was a complete and utter immoral bastard" to be jarring on some level. Of course the internet has meant people have been able to take delight in sometimes causing that kind of offence (I'll hold my own hand up here) but at least this raises the subject. I think first of all we have to get to the point where we can discuss these things without automatic offence being taken but maybe that will take a bit of outrage on both sides first.

This is why it's so fucked up imo - it's perfectly possible for a bloke to be celibate in the intercourse stakes but denying them any form of release (in theory)shows as I said a basic lack of knowledge of humanity. You can imagine the poor bastards being racked by guilt even when they get a hard on never mind have a wet dream. As soon as you teach people that something natural is sinful and sinful = damnation then you mess them up.

The argument is that priests who do have problems (obviously a tiny minority) because of celibacy - including a ban on masturbation - who develop a generally twisted view of sex express that with the only option available - vulnerable people who inhabit their "world" - in other words if there were choir girls then they would be just as likely to be victims.

The best post in this thread. Give some examples of them being annoying. Have they ever said that religious people were less than human? (as Cormac O'Connor said about Atheists) Have they ever ignored the deaths of millions of South Americans and said they were "crying out for Christ" before conquest like Ratzinger?