Baggio

Has he got Geordie grandparents?

Did you watch it on Premiership Plus?

At Roma he was 5 times the player Bellamy was when he was here, unfortunately he's 5 times a bigger troublemaker, I don't think I've ever seen a player with a better first touch than him, fantastic player. We really need someone who can come in and hit the floor running, we can't afford to give him time to adapt, he's also put some weight on since being at Madrid.

Wasn't Shepherd at the Palermo match though? I seem to remember the commentator's saying he was jumping for joy in the directors box at the final whistle Can't see him going out there and then missing this one, if he did then it was an obvious dodge on his part.

I wonder if anyone is still backing Roeder now? This is awful.

I'm on the under 2.5 goals today. 1.73 (about 3/4) on Betfair.

I can't see how selling N'Zogbia would cut the wage bill that much, I bet he's on less than half of what Luque and Butt are on.

The Intertoto cup that is! Of the remaining 4 teams, the groups look like this... UEFA Cup : Group A Table 1 Rangers 2 6 2 Maccabi Haifa 2 3 3 Partizan Belgrade 1 1 4 Livorno 2 1 5 Auxerre 1 0 UEFA Cup : Group C Table 1 AZ 2 6 2 Braga 2 3 3 Sevilla 1 1 4 Liberec 2 1 5 Grasshoppers 1 0 UEFA Cup : Group D Table 1 Lens 1 3 2 Odense BK 2 3 3 Parma 1 3 4 Osasuna 2 1 5 Heerenveen 2 0 1 UEFA Cup : Group H Table 1 Newcastle 2 6 2 Palermo 2 3 3 Celta Vigo 1 1 4 Eintracht Frankfurt 2 1 5 Fenerbahce 1 0 Open bus tour through the City in the near future?

Luque rises to the challenge at last to sink Sicilians Michael Walker at Stadio Renzo Barbera Friday November 3, 2006 The Guardian Remarkable gets over-used as a description in sport but Newcastle United, and three of their players in particular - Tim Krul, Albert Luque and Andy Carroll - merited it last night. Krul, an 18-year-old Dutch goalkeeper, made his debut and in keeping a clean sheet, Newcastle's third in a row, he was outstanding. In defying Andrea Caracciolo and David Di Michele in the 67th minute Krul, moreover, has already had the Newcastle version of his Jim Montgomery moment and as he said afterwards: "I will never forget this night for as long as I live." When he walked into the Newcastle dressing room, last in, Krul was given a standing ovation. His double save helped ensure that Newcastle held on to the 37th-minute lead provided by Luque, only the third goal from the Spaniard in the 15 months since his £9.5m transfer from Deportivo La Coruna. As Glenn Roeder asked of him on Wednesday, Luque proved he may yet have a future at St James' Park, though it is only a first tentative step. On a night of no little vindication for Roeder, Newcastle's manager was also able to give a debut to Carroll in injury-time. Replacing Nolberto Solano, Carroll, at 17 and 267 days, became United's youngest player in 37 years of European football. Carroll's big day ended with his team on top of Group H, with Newcastle now virtually assured of participation in the knock-out phase beginning in the new year. Under intense pressure on Tyneside due to Newcastle's weak Premiership results, Roeder will hope that beating Palermo, currently second in Serie A, comes to be seen as a turning point. It will be said that Palermo started with just five regulars and that Simplicio and Di Michele, scorers of three of the four goals that accounted for West Ham in the preliminary round, came on too late, but this was a mature Newcastle performance from a team sprinkled with youth. "The collective team spirit running through our team clearly showed tonight," said Roedera "and given that we left senior players back in Newcastle due to injury and asked a number of others to step up who don't normally play, it was nothing short of brilliant. It's a major result for us for many reasons." He added: "Palermo are not to be under-rated - where they are in Serie A is a true reflection of their quality. I hope this now gives us the confidence in the Premiership. You can see we are not playing like a side in our Premiership position." Roeder revealed that the plan for Krul was to send him out on loan - "and we may still do that". He explained: "I thought his debut was 18 months to two years away. He's had a night to remember." Physical recovery is now an issue for Roeder's players before the home game with Sheffield United tomorrow but spirits are undoubtedly lifted. With Nicky Butt giving a master class at the base of a five-man midfield, a fixture that looked treacherous was handled with care. Krul was beaten twice in the first 12 minutes but on each occasion Craig Moore got back to clear. Moore had one of his best displays in a Newcastle jersey, as did James Milner. Playing on the left, Milner was a release valve for Newcastle when he could be, but was also prepared to carry the attack to the Sicilians. Robbing Andrea Barzagli on 10 minutes, Milner forced the Sicilian goalkeeper Alberto Fontana into a smart save and he might have had a penalty then as Barzagli was dragging him back as he shot. And it was Milner who delivered the fantastic cross from the left that Luque met six yards out to steer beyond Fontana. It was a fine goal and may persuade the disaffected Spaniard that he can make a go of it at St James'. Overall Luque's was a much improved effort but as Roeder said: "He needs to keep on working hard." After the goal Newcastle were comfortable for the next half-hour and when Palermo were able to break through, Krul was there. Of Newcastle's 16, last night he was one of eight who came through the academy, another positive from a remarkable night for the club.

The best thing we could do for the lad is to loan him out to a team from the Championship once Given returns, similar to what Man Utd/Liverpool have done with Foster/Carson (technically they have gone to lower Premiership clubs before someone points that out )

Sven's Coaching CV 1976: Degerfors (Assistant Coach) 1977-78: Degerfors (Coach) 1979-82: IFK Gothenburg Swedish Cup Winners 1979 Swedish League Champions 1981 Swedish League Champions 1982 UEFA Cup Winners 1982 1982-84: SL Benfica Portuguese League Champions 1983 Portuguese League Champions 1984 Portuguese Cup Winners 1983 1984-87: AS Roma Italian Cup Winners 1986 1987-89: AC Fiorentina 1989-92: SL Benfica Portuguese League Champions 1991 1992-97: Sampdoria UC Italian Cup Winners 1994 1997-2000: SS Lazio Italian Cup Winners 1998 Italian Super Cup Winners 1998 UEFA Cup Winners' Cup Winners 1999 UEFA Super Cup Winners 1999 Italian League Champions 2000

Sven is the best manager we could realistically get IMO. His record at club level has been excellent nearly everywhere he's been, yes he spent a lot of money at Lazio but no more than we've given Souness and Roeder over the last few years, he also picked up a few bargains along the way (Nedved for less than £3 million) Being the England manager has enabled him to watch hundreds of Premiership games over the last few years, he would have seen plenty of players who stood out (English and Foreign) who he could mould into a decent team. I'm 100% behind bringing him in

Just had a bet on Martins to score tonight at 3.3 on Betfair (about 9/4) Had a bet on him in our last game in the Uefa Cup, me and my old man had £20 each on him getting a hatrick, with two early second half goals I was practically counting the money until that bastard Roeder took him off

Emre will either be outstanding or get sent off, not sure which yet.

I have to agree with Leazes here, that is plainly not true. When Bellamy first arrived he was a nothing player who'd just flopped at Coventry, he'd only managed 4 caps for Wales and most thought we paid over the odds at the time. Martins on the other hand has managed to score 1 in 3 at a far bigger club than we're ever likely to be, got an average of 1 in 2 in the CL, 7 in 6 in the UEFA cup and 11 in 13 for his country. For someone who likes to spout about facts so much LM I hope you enjoy these, do you think the Bellamy we signed then is better than Shevchenko now? after all he hasn't settled in yet and with your poor knowledge of football outside of this country I doubt you've ever heard of him. BTW are you still backing Roeder? I've asked you several times over on N-O yet you seem to be avoiding the question. You're a clueless arse. A few people rated Bellamy before he signed for Newcastle. He was a bargain and it was obvious in his very first game, if you couldn't see that it is confirmation you are blind as well as having poor judgment. A few goals doesn't make Martins a better footballer than Bellamy. Bellamy is a support striker, again if you can't appreciate this - or the difference between the roles - by now and cling onto a goals stattistic then it is simply more added proof that you are clueless. BTW, I am not avoiding any questions unlike quite a lot of people on here and NO. And to be honest, I don't give a flying fuck who is better than Craig Bellamy, all I saw is a player who was brilliant for Newcastle United and prolonged Alan Shearers career by at least 2 years. I mean, I can ask you a question. Are you really so dumb as you seem ? [but to be fair you aren't the only one] Very very few had seen Bellamy never mind rate him Leazes. He was appalling all season at Coventry. He himself acknowledges that he had a poor time at Cov. He was injured prior to that at Norwich so how people had managed to rate him is beyond me. Norwichs live performances on telly were few and far between. I thought his pace would be useful and a few Norwich fans I knew said he would do well but beyond that few people had a clue about him. Shearer benefited, but it is daft to imply that the partnership was anything other than complimentary. Certainly 70 goals didnt score themselves. If it was that easy then the 27 year old Craig Bellamy would have more than Alan Shearer scored in those 3 seasons. Martins needs time and decent players around him. It is unfortunate that some hanker after an arsehole who couldnt give a toss about anyone but himself. That statement is so bound up in empirical evidence that it doesnt need qualifying. Nor reiterating no matter how fanciful the defence of him can be. Give Martins a chance and wait til we have someone worthy of the shirt to play alongside him. He has shown decent glimpes and scored good goals. However, he is ploughing a lonely furrow when we boot 50 yard balls over his head. We wont see anywhere near his potential in my view until we get shot of the current manager and/or replace half a dozen faces in the first team. Well I thought he had good potential at Coventry, when he played through the middle near to Hartson it was obvious it was his best position rather than out wide where Strachan played him [good manager and better than Roeder because he's won the Scottish League ] and I was very pleased when we bought him, although I realise I have no proof of that, having said it on talk of the tyne and the old nufc.nu forum at the time. Of course the partnership with Shearer was 2 way. But Bellamy and Robert DID catapult Newcastle from being a mid table team with no pace or creativity into a top 4 side. Most players only care about themselves, people generally do. Bellamy however played over 50 games for Newcastle with a knee needing surgery, you won't find many players doing that. Martins may just need a chance, but I - along with isegrim - share the concern over his wild finishing and slashing at chances. You either have it or you don't. Micky Quinn was a player who wasn't really good outside the box but inside he was deadly, accurate and came alive. You watch him...he only needed a split second and 99 times out of 100 he hit the target, no matter where or how the ball came to him, the keeper had to stop the ball or it would have been in. Thats an example of a limited player, but one who had the goalscoring knack. If Martins is going to be an out and out goalscorer, and not contribute much to team play, he needs to be accurate and take his opportunities to justify it. I obviously hope he does, as he has pace he would be hard to contain. The purchase of Robert and Bellamy were right for the positions that needed filling at the time. They helped the rest of a very good midfield and attack push us to where we got. We also had a very effective Gary Speed and highly effective Dyer Solano conbination in Dec/Jan/Feb and more the second season. On top of that we had a bloke who could finish like no other Newcastle player (or any other club) recently had. They didnt catapult us, they were the last pieces of a jigsaw that was very effective. Splitting hairs I know but it always suggests to me that they did more than the rest and they didnt. It was highly effective team play. At present we are nowhere near buying for appropriate positions, have a bloke injured who could replace Alan Shearer but we will see, Martins is nowt but a youngun who needs time. He COULD be very good but we wont know til we sort out the rest of the shambles. Even our back four in that first season of Hughes, Distin, Dabizas and O'Brien were light years ahead of our current set up. Its hard to see one player from the current side who would oust one player from that side on current form. Duff has the ability to but hasnt managed to as our system just isnt working for him either. Emre is a good player but limited when we need some physical presence. Parker is good but not as good as many rate him - certainly Gary Speed was better and offered more going forward. I would personally prefer to see him as a box to box player with somone commanding alongside him in the mould of Sissoko or Papa Diop. Martins needs someone up front with him as I mentioned. The back four need binning altogether. Not one of them from Ramage, Taylor, Carr, Babayaro or Bramble is good enough for the shirt. Its hard work at present but its been coming for a long long time. Mismanagement of players, wasting money on clueless managers aswell as players acting/playing like arseholes have all been evident since 2003-4. something has to change. Whether it is policy or personnel is open to debate but watching that shower of shite in a stadium well short of capacity should send alarm bells ringing. Good post gram. I agree, top post LeazesMag - I'll ignore your insults as its clear you're still upset with me for saying your forum was shit

What a goal!

"Both sides have plenty of door openers"

As Renton has said, I was talking about their career before they joined Newcastle. Having said that Bellamy did have the advantage of playing under a far superior manager who actually uses tactics, he also partnered one of the best strikers in the league at the time. Martins on the other hand has to play under a clueless manager with long ball tactics and has the pleasure of partnering either Shola or Sibierski. If the whole team were playing well apart from Martins then I'd be worried about him, but as the whole team looks awful, is creating nothing and seems as motivated as they were under Souness then I'll reserve judgement on his Newcastle career. The same as most have with Duff.

I have to agree with Leazes here, that is plainly not true. When Bellamy first arrived he was a nothing player who'd just flopped at Coventry, he'd only managed 4 caps for Wales and most thought we paid over the odds at the time. Martins on the other hand has managed to score 1 in 3 at a far bigger club than we're ever likely to be, got an average of 1 in 2 in the CL, 7 in 6 in the UEFA cup and 11 in 13 for his country. For someone who likes to spout about facts so much LM I hope you enjoy these, do you think the Bellamy we signed then is better than Shevchenko now? after all he hasn't settled in yet and with your poor knowledge of football outside of this country I doubt you've ever heard of him. BTW are you still backing Roeder? I've asked you several times over on N-O yet you seem to be avoiding the question.

Martins has been poor so far, but has he really been that much worse than the rest of the squad? Everyone seems to be playing below par with the exception of Carr, Ramage etc who are playing to their usual shite standards, Parker played better under Souness than he has under Roeder this season and Duff has gone from one of the best wingers in the league to average in the space of a summer. They're not on their own, Solano was one of our best players at the end of last season yet some are writing him off as 'past it' after half a dozen games this campaign, Zoggy looks lost and Taylor is looks like he's been taking tips off Bramble on how to defend. The blame has to lie with Roeder, his tactics this season seem to be for Martins to stay close to Shola and feed off any flick on or have Emre play 70 yard passes behind the opposition back line and hope that Martins gets there before it reaches their keeper. We'll never get the best out of him like that, he's a far better player than Bellamy was when he first arrived but with the right coaching we transformed him into an excellent player, I just can't see Roeder and Terry Mac doing that with Martins.

He's certainly not the sort of player we should have gone for if we were planning on playing long ball football all season.

Lee Carsley, he may have zero footballing ability but at least he gets stuck in So, what else is Emre offering at the moment than getting stuck in? Emre is doing his job the best he can with the team he's in, he's winning balls and spreading them about the pitch, his biggest problem is that we seem to have zero movement in the side, as I've said to you before if you put him in Arsenal's starting 11 he'd be one of the best midfielders in the league. Our team play awful football which is the reason we doesn't shine as often as he should, could you imagine Carrick in our midfield with the long ball style we play? Perhaps he is the weak link in our midfield, however I'd prefer to change our style of football to fit a player of his ability rather than get rid and play another midfielder who's more comfortable with long ball football.

Lee Carsley, he may have zero footballing ability but at least he gets stuck in

No, he is just a player I don't really rate and like. Is he related to you? Predictable and unjustified response. I rate him, it's true, but you slate him far more often and with far less relevence than I ever praise him. Where is the relevance lacking? I just answered to the question. This was also in relation to the fact that I have had several disagreements with Baggio on here and on N-O (e.g. today) about the value of Emre for Newcastle as I think he is overall ineffective. What's unjustified with this. It's my opinion, that I think is backed up by the team performances and the results lately. I don't think you can make Emre the scapegoat for our poor performances. Especially as he's been one of our better players this season.

I'd pick Emre over Parker every time. Parker is supposed to be the box to box midfielder yet he offers nothing going forward, has little ability with the ball at his feet but gets overhyped because he 'gets stuck in' Making him captain was a big mistake.