OTF

If we keep with our current rate of improvement we should score 6 against Wolves, concede negative 3 and soon catch Chelsea's for and against

14th to 17th is where I think we'll be as well. There's a chance we could surprise though, there is quite a few weak sides in the league if we can take as many points off the likes of West Ham, Wigan, Blackpool, Wolves, West Brom, Birmingham, Stoke and Blackburn then we could feasibly finish above them all which would have us in 12th. From there Sunderland, Bolton and Fulham are there for the taking if they have poor seasons. There's 8 teams I just can't see us finishing above (Chelsea, Manure, Arse, Man Clitty, Totspurs, Everton, Liverpool, & AVilla).

No doubt Owen rejected the offer when he realised it didn't include a pay rise or any sort of bonus.

He's not going to get a move away and a massive raise. No way in the world. Club won't let him leave for cheap - anything less than 6 million and they're better off hanging onto him for the season IMO. Noone buying at this late stage will be paying wages over what he gets here, if they do then they've got more dollars than sense.

Wasn't he on trial here some time ago, before his move to Hull? Scored some good own goals IIRC. We should just get Beye. He can fill in at centre back also.

If he does actually want to stay it's a pretty obvious piece of propaganda from the club putting this transfer listing bollocks up in the hope that he will sign their contract offer. If he's actually on the way out it could be their way of softening the blow. At this stage in the season I think it would be foolish to lose him as it's at best unlikely that we have any sort of replacement lined up. Anyone that we would bring in would be a last minute 'he'll do' sort of signing which much more often than not doesn't come off. Do I think Coloccini, Williamson, Campbell and Kadar are enough cover at centre back? Not really. Simpson and Perch can play there at a pinch, but that's not something I want to have to see this season. I doubt the 60k figure being bandied about is true, but if it is someone needs to deflate his head (again).

Xisco is out apparently. Kind of disappointing as I was looking forward to seeing hi over 90. This match is on TV live over here.

Got any stories about him? He was caught fisting himself in the toilet at lunchtime I thought HAT was talking about Andy from Gateshead not Kevin from Derry??? Is your avatar a crime scene photo?

Wolves and Blackpool we have to be targeting 3 points, Everton will be a lot tougher but hopefully we're in good form at that point. This is a very easy run of games in this league, so we really have to take advantage of it.

Can't forsee Hughton going anywhere this season, unless we're in a relegation scrap. What happens after his contract is up is anyones guess. I suspect he'd be afforded a minor increase by Ashley/Lambbias if he does decently and expected to stay.

What gives you that indication?

Didn't mind the Xisco substitution, but it will be quite annoying if Vuckic doesn't get chances in matches like that when he has so much promise. With the signing of Tiote and Guthrie returning from injury he'll fall further down the pecking order, further away from potential time on the pitch that will be invaluable to his development and also the likeliness that he will form a strong attachment to the club and will re-sign. Coming on in a winning premier league side in front of 40k+ would have been a great experience for him. Shola could have been left planted on the bench and Vuckic could have replaced Nolan.

I reckon it's more likely he'd bet some mug that we'd win. Not half enjoying it is he?

Agree with that, and have the same worries about Enrique... But as you say, enjoy the result, and what a result it was!

Wow! Simply Amazing. Fitting that Carroll got his hat-trick. He was clearly Man-of-the-Match, which for once is actually saying something because there was plenty of excellent contributors in the side. A classic match for us, lets hope the lads use it and go on a bit of a run. We have some winnable matches coming up as well. If carroll keeps up with that form he'll honestly have a fantastic season and will forge a spot for himself in the England side. It may sound foolish to say that, but he was just that good. From the aerial dominance, to the intelligent runs and passes, and of course the clinical finishing. All you can ask for. Other noteable mentions, Jose Enrique had a blinder, defended resolutely and linked up in attack well with Jonas, really showing the initiative in getting forward to add a spark to our attack. If he plays with the same intent and commitment throughout the season our attack will be all the better for it. Kevin Nolan was at his best, not just slotting in nicely and picking up goals, but he actually made some good passes - most notably when he spotted space for Routledge to run into. Perch was dramatically improved from his nervous first outing last week. In the middle Coloccini and Williamson were excellent in the air and did well in general. Alan Smith also had a solid game. And have to give some credit to Shola Ameobi for the awkward assist for Nolan's second, and of the course the much-maligned Xisco who layed off a perfect ball into the path of Carroll to allow him to complete the almost fairy tale hat-trick!

...can't help but wonder if Ashley will put the cheque book away after this... <suppress the negativity>

<pinches self> Horrible from harper for their penalty - add some scuffed clearances and it was a very shaky start from him. Thanks Carew for that miss, because it could have been oh so different. Absolute screamer from Barton. I sat in disbelief for half a second. Second goal was one to remember. Fantastic run from Enrique, after good lead up work down the left, intelligent movement and passing/heading from Carroll and Nolan. The third, well that was icing on the first half cake. We had all the momentum at that point, so rare to see us make use of it on the scoreboard. Even Perch is looking half decent, linking up and defending when required. We look most vulnerable through the middle. I'm sure they're aware of our lack of pace there, so they'll probably have Ashley Young looking to beat the offside trap through the middle, right through the second half.

I bet Mike felt good about the manager complimenting his play, until that is, he heard Perch getting similar praise.

It's all down to how much is wanted by OM, and how much he's rated by us. It's all smoke and mirrors from our perspective, just hope it's sorted out soon. As Kitman notes 37 pages is indicitive of the frustrating drawn out nature of this potential bit of business. Certainly will creat some pre-match buzz and not harm ticket sales if it was sorted prior to the match on Sunday, but that's too much to ask of the clowns involved (both on our side and theirs) I'm afraid.

Not injecting new faces of any noteable quality is just the kind of ignorant move that Ashley has proven himself entirely capable of committing. A new player, of reasonable pedigree would have so many positive effetcs that it's almost impossible to reason not doing so: (i) First and foremost improve the quality of a squad that is lacking in several areas (ii) Improve general excitment amongst supporters resulting in increased attendances and merchandise sales (iii) Improve team morale, increase competition for positions and remove complacency Ultimately it would reduce the risk of another relegation.

But at the same time I would like us to give some of the fringe players a run and preserve. In particular give Vuckic a chance in the midfield but play him alongside Barton or Nolan to have a balance of experience. Shola can start up front. Our next game after this one is 28th of Augustand is a bloody important one away at Wolves. On one hand we don't want to pickup any injuries in the leadup to that, but on the other it would be good to play some of our more senior players into some form.

I can't for the life of me, excluding the small matter of money, see why James Milner would want to go to Man City? Going there in my opinion will slow his development and affect his role in the English side. He's certain to get many less minutes at Man City where they're stacked with midfielders. I don't like Villa but at least there he was guaranteed a starting role. Bad for the league as well when good players continue to go to the same teams where many sit and rot away while lesser teams drop in quality as a result.

It will be very interesting to see how he goes at Cardiff. I'm picking that he'll be injured for large periods.

Mods, can there be a sub-forum created where old timers can argue about things in the past?