Howay

So from the starters in their game against West Ham that’s Firpo (who played lb) and Forshaw (who played CM) out on top of what I assume the players who had already been out for that one. I’d like it to be called off so that we could have more players in for it but fucking hell man it’s depressing that we can’t even feel in any way confident of beating this lot even though we almost have a clean bill of health

Agreed, I think it’s one of those where it’s a shrewd move if we pull the loan off at the end of the window, but we are risking someone else coming in (which currently doesn’t seem to be the case but injuries in upcoming fixtures might change that picture). I think it’s fine to play this game, as I agree it’s the one to make here, but we need to pursue alternative targets to him in the meantime as if we assume we will get him and then get gazumped before the window closes we might be scrambling late - this is of course if he was a real target rather than being a kind of nice to have to boost the squad type of target.

I don’t think overpaying now = overpaying forever. We would have a stronger hand in negotiations later on after improvements and will be able to do things like allow contracts to run down etc. I don’t think anyone is saying overpay and get Carlos for £80m. The point is more if that’s absolutely Sevilla’s ask we need to walk away, we’ve spent 3 weeks chasing two CBs and have none. If we had went after others who may not be as good we might have improved our CB position - maybe overpaid a bit like we did for Wood, and went back into negotiations over Carlos with a stronger hand when he turned more into a nice to have rather than the must have he seems like at the moment. Hopefully we do bring players in, but at the moment it’s an awfully big ask to bring in what we need in a little over a week.

What was the last offer £1.5m? Are we going to go up in £500k increments or maybe go with £100k increments until they accept or Stevie Geeeee comes out of nowhere with a £10m loan offer.

Agreed on the point but we’re kind of over a barrel and have no leverage in any negotiation. It’s Manchester United’s last chance to get any money for him, the only thing they’d save is 6 months wages if they let him go for no fee + 100% wages which to them makes no difference. I understand people’s point that certain clubs might fold and be more open to sell nearer the end of the window as they really do want the money - but a lot of the ones we are going for seem happy enough to hold on until the summer window so I’m not sure if this tactic would make sense. Maybe it applies more to say Burnley who seem in real short term cash need, and we go and nick Tarkowski off them, but I think Sevilla are likely happy to hold onto Carlos until summer the same way Lille seem okay with waiting until the summer to sell Botman.

Bellend road

He’s been sort of pushing for a move for a while now. Tbh I’d be happy if we offloaded him in the summer, he’s not good enough for the PL. He’s not good enough technically to make up for being so lightweight. At this point it’ll be worth it alone so I stop seeing fans of his stupid old MLS club bemoaning how this unbelievable talent is being wasted at a shit club, he’s part of the reason we are shit lads.

To be fair the post only states a number that were effective, he could have triple the attempted long balls others on the list have. Shelvey is wank tbh. I don’t give a flying fuck what stat that bloke who said he was good used he’s a passenger most games, he’s got the ability to be impactful but he so rarely shows it.

Agreed, I think even if they do want to keep trying to sign Carlos they should look to bring in another CB that was further down their list just to make sure we get one that improves us since we honestly need 2 anyway. Really hope we can get Lingard in, I think he’s a good improvement on Fraser. Maybe he could drop into CM as others said too, either way he improves us.

I know all the external reasons people will highlight of why this is going the way it is, and I get it, but fucking hell only us eh. When fucking Chelsea, Man City, and Paris had similar loadsamoney takeover the money was flying and players were coming in, when ours happens we’re basically head butting walls and having discussions about being careful of FFP.

Lingard would be a class loan/transfer, I think he’s a big improvement on Fraser. The only issue with it remains that our CM can’t get the forwards the fucking ball so we really need to improve that. Loan would be hilarious btw if nothing else but to wind up that bloke who said a loan for Lingard would be impossible.

Aye they are. I’m getting a bit fed up of hearing the pundits yell about how youth players should make up the difference, ignoring the fact that just further favors the top sides who have the best academy’s. I think in cases like Arsenals where they’re sending people out on loan the youth players should have to be temporarily registered to bring the squad up to 25, but asking Burnley to field whatever fucking crap is in their academy is harsh.

So that’s Danny Batth and Jermaine Defoe they’ve got / are trying to get? They are away it’s 2022 and not 2012 right?

I gave this a like despite your unnecessary attack on CPA’s 😒.

My point wasn’t throw 80m at a player though, my point was just that if the club want a player, he will play in our team for a bit and do decent, then the money we paid for him isn’t going to be an issue if it’s 40m and he’s “worth” 25m. FFP isn’t going to break us when we are talking about the deal for Carlos tbh. I’d agree if we were planning to go mental and throw 80m at him to hit his release clause, but we’re not. I can’t really speak to Evertons issues but I know they are ran like a fucking joke, they’ve spent nearly half a billion quid on shit players - I am just saying if we overpay for a few that do a job for us currently it’s not going to be any issue. We have a good amount in the reserve, and a huge sponsorship deficit to make up just to get our sponsorships level with other PL clubs. When I said the Carlos fee doesn’t matter I’m meaning the perceived overpayment of 15m or whatever it might be, not throw 150m and 200k a week at the bloke. From what I understand wages is where we are keeping a clear structure (hence losing out on Digne as he demanded 150k a week). I think FFP can at times be a bit of an overblown specter too. Man city slapped it aside in court, and Everton ended up spending £22m on a left back and registering him fine weeks before they sold Digne. The issues Barca are having are La Liga FFP rules and Barca are ran like a total shit show too.

It is yes, but there’s a lot of pre-judging the player tbh. Maybe he will come in and be shit but I seriously doubt he will be worse than Lascelles, Clark and the current version of Schar - put any of those three in the Sevilla defence and I doubt it would look as solid. I’ve read differing things on him, Diego thinks he’s shit, then I’ve heard other things where people rate him among the form defenders in la liga, I’m willing to give him a chance. I have no idea what Boumsong was like in France tbh, but he had went to Rangers on a free iirc before we bought him in a deal that was dodgy as fuck so I’m not sure he was that immense.

Money doesn’t really matter to our club now, it’s like all the ‘mis steps’ man city made early buying players that looking back weren’t great, they overpaid for, but helped them along the way. It’s like the 25m for wood, it’s an overpayment sure but it won’t matter in the grand scheme of things, it would matter if we were under Ashley and he was our massive outlay for the foreseeable future but this lot are seemingly trying to spend over 100m on players in this window alone (they’d have spent 80m on Botman and Carlos alone). If he comes in, does a decent job and helps us stay up, eventually becomes a squad player or moves away for 12m or so I can’t imagine any of us would feel it wasn’t worth it.

Aye, I understand the concern but he surely can’t be that bad? They’ve conceded 13 goals in 19 games and he’s started all of them. Maybe he looks like the weak one in their defence? I can’t see him being anything like the liability Lascelles is

This is becoming very close to the “just can’t get him over the line” banter. It’s almost exactly the same as the way the Botman deal was reported. Can we just get some more realistic targets in? Surely someone is willing to sell like Gladbach who Isegrim pointed out. Why the fuck are our lot being so focused on certain players rather than trying to improve the team?

Players are available that improve us considerably but publicly it seems we are getting tunnel vision about Carlos like we did with Botman. The hope is that the public perception doesn’t equal what’s happening in reality, but it seems like it has been another day with no progress.

Honest question, did Willock really look that good at the end of last season? Or did his absurd amount of goals distort people’s view of him? I genuinely can’t remember and if I try I’m definitely factoring in his goals heavily. The goals were always going to dry up at the rate he was scoring but I can’t remember what his overall performances were like tbh. I agree with HMHM, we can’t rely on any of these CMs over 20 games this season none of them have done anything to help create things on offense, I think hoping for Willock to suddenly perform is kind of like hoping for Shelvey to suddenly give a fuck and turn in performances like he does on extremely rare occasions. He’s had injuries etc this season so I’m not writing the lad off completely in the longer term but I don’t want to depend on him this season.

We need a CM we aren’t going to win games with this central midfield. They generate absolutely fucking nothing. I understand the defence has been the focus, and rightly so due to how poor it is, but imo at this point CM is equally important due to our dire need to win games. We can’t rely on ASM to make and score a goal from fucking nothing like he did against Watford, we need to be generating chances.

Good analogy. Agreed on both, given the choice I’d rather make that jump but I wouldn’t be devastated if they went the other way as I’d see the approach as you point out.