spongebob toonpants

He's got an awful lot in common with Blair IMO. Both very clever operators that will only show a perfectly manicured public persona and will (and do) have very strong spin teams. Which is self evidently an absolute necessity in modern politics - I would also say they both are attempting to provide a progessive liberal government for their country, rather than purely lusting after power for its own sake Er... you're saying Blair or Brown didn't lust after power? Where have you been exactly for the last 12 years? Also "progressive liberal"? By ever moving the Goverments into peoples lives, curtailing all manner of freedoms and making "anti-terror" law a Carte blanche for everything from seizing Iceland assets to making spying on your bins or making sure your kids live in the right address. Aye, "liberal". Progressively neo-fascist with good camouflage and spin machines maybe..... or I suppose liberal in the context that everyone is equally oppressed. No I didnt say Blair or Brown didnt lust after power, I said they didnt purely lust after power. I think they had a desire to acheive power because they wanted a better fairer form of government. As for progressive liberal government - I agree its an easy phrase to mock and the anti terror stuff I have big problems with. By progressive I was meaning mainly a redistributive tax and social policy - which to some extent was acheived. You seem to beleive a politician by definition is out for power and nothing else. I disagree

He's got an awful lot in common with Blair IMO. Both very clever operators that will only show a perfectly manicured public persona and will (and do) have very strong spin teams. Which is self evidently an absolute necessity in modern politics - I would also say they both are attempting to provide a progessive liberal government for their country, rather than purely lusting after power for its own sake

In spite of Blairs failures, and putting to one side Iraq, I do think Blair and New Labour have had a much greater positive effect than many. I think the country is a better place for the Labour Govt, the inimum wage had a huge effect, Schools and the NHS though still coming in for justified criticism are immeasurably better than in 1997 - people forget the extent of the dilapidation that they faced. The ridiculous Joe the Plumber meme about 3% tax increase over 250,000 dollars highlight how succesful in winning the argument over the benefits of progressive taxation labour was. However we now find ourself back looking at being governed by Cameron and his 18 old Etonian cronies, with Labour unable to offer a cogent argument for the future - I am so dissapointed by how this period is ending and the opportunity wasted - they could and should have acheived so much more.

It's not that insignificant and ironically many vote republican traditionally. He knew what he as doing and played it very well (sorry to shatter his White er.. Black er... Inclusive Knight persona ). Fair enough, remove the 'totally' bit from what I said and replace it with largely and I stand by what I said. Regarding the bit in bold, I didn't buy into that anyway or a lot of his other rhetoric. But it doesn't really have much to do with my point anyway. I agree mostly with what you say about him. I think he'll end up just like everybody else once they get in, hence my previous 'Tommy Carcetti' quip. I just think, in terms of votes, he would have had much more to gain by making it far clearer he wasn't a Muslim (perhaps I'm doing the US a disservice there though, I'm just guessing) than the ambiguity/clever manipulation I think you're accusing him of. There aren't that many Muslims in the US. They aren't concentrated in terms of population like the Jewish population in New York which waters down their influence even more. Many US muslims are African-American converts who would have voted for him anyway. The remaining Muslims would surely have tended to favour a Democrat given the last 8 years under Bush and so on. In a way the horrible position he is taking over with the economy in ruins and the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq might actually liberate him from some extent from the fate of Carcetti. Blair squandered a lot of his honeymoon period by being cautious - Obama has the chance to avoid this as he taking over in such turmoil I know I'm a idealist old lefty romantic, but I watched his acceptance speech live this morning, and found it moving and inspiring. I actually think it is a great day for America. I hate evangelical born again right wing hate America, but I do think America can be a fantastic inspiring place. I know what you mean and I'd agree to an extent. My reservations are more to do with that despite him wanting change and believing in it, the system might not let him. I'm pretty certain he won't make the same foreign policy mess as his predecessor though which can only be a good thing. I agree, you cant beat the system. The Carceti arc in the wire was beautifully written and horribly authentic and depressing. I hope and think Obama can still be a transforming leader and an inspiration, but I am realistic enough to know he will be hamstrung and opposed by the broken institutions and corporate power every step of the way. Its going to be fascinating to see how he does

It's not that insignificant and ironically many vote republican traditionally. He knew what he as doing and played it very well (sorry to shatter his White er.. Black er... Inclusive Knight persona ). Fair enough, remove the 'totally' bit from what I said and replace it with largely and I stand by what I said. Regarding the bit in bold, I didn't buy into that anyway or a lot of his other rhetoric. But it doesn't really have much to do with my point anyway. I agree mostly with what you say about him. I think he'll end up just like everybody else once they get in, hence my previous 'Tommy Carcetti' quip. I just think, in terms of votes, he would have had much more to gain by making it far clearer he wasn't a Muslim (perhaps I'm doing the US a disservice there though, I'm just guessing) than the ambiguity/clever manipulation I think you're accusing him of. There aren't that many Muslims in the US. They aren't concentrated in terms of population like the Jewish population in New York which waters down their influence even more. Many US muslims are African-American converts who would have voted for him anyway. The remaining Muslims would surely have tended to favour a Democrat given the last 8 years under Bush and so on. Well 8-15 million isn't going to win it (even with a very high turn out), but any sensible politician knows that all votes count in one way or another. But I do think he was clever with it, he did deny it enough to for it to not be an issue with the main vote, but left enough to allow the muslim population to believe what they wanted to believe. He did the same with his "race" (he's "Black" when he needs to be and "White" when he needs to be - when in fact he's Blite or Whack ) to be honest, and his policies. Which does make what he will do quite interesting in a way. I think that underestimates the quality of his campaign, I dont think he played up particularly to white/black christian/muslim divide at all. He appealled to the intelligence over stupidity, and calm over knee jerk, and help the poor not the rich. He pretty much ignored the Ayres/ Wright/ Acorn attacks on his backround - it would have been easy enough to tie McCain to Gordon Liddy, to have attacked his affair while his first wife was recovering from a road accident and remarrying before the divorce was finalised, he could have rubbished McCains military record which bears very little scrutiny but he ran a dignified intelligent campaign and won a huge victory.

It's not that insignificant and ironically many vote republican traditionally. He knew what he as doing and played it very well (sorry to shatter his White er.. Black er... Inclusive Knight persona ). Fair enough, remove the 'totally' bit from what I said and replace it with largely and I stand by what I said. Regarding the bit in bold, I didn't buy into that anyway or a lot of his other rhetoric. But it doesn't really have much to do with my point anyway. I agree mostly with what you say about him. I think he'll end up just like everybody else once they get in, hence my previous 'Tommy Carcetti' quip. I just think, in terms of votes, he would have had much more to gain by making it far clearer he wasn't a Muslim (perhaps I'm doing the US a disservice there though, I'm just guessing) than the ambiguity/clever manipulation I think you're accusing him of. There aren't that many Muslims in the US. They aren't concentrated in terms of population like the Jewish population in New York which waters down their influence even more. Many US muslims are African-American converts who would have voted for him anyway. The remaining Muslims would surely have tended to favour a Democrat given the last 8 years under Bush and so on. In a way the horrible position he is taking over with the economy in ruins and the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq might actually liberate him from some extent from the fate of Carcetti. Blair squandered a lot of his honeymoon period by being cautious - Obama has the chance to avoid this as he taking over in such turmoil I know I'm a idealist old lefty romantic, but I watched his acceptance speech live this morning, and found it moving and inspiring. I actually think it is a great day for America. I hate evangelical born again right wing hate America, but I do think America can be a fantastic inspiring place.

It's funny he's played an interesting game with that. He's denied it enough to wash with the mainstream vote (he isn't, although he has family members that are), but not enough so that the majority of American muslims don't still think he is a muslim too. Well played by him on that one. Thats bollocks obviously, amusing bollocks but bollocks none the less. Nice tactic of saying it often enough to gain currency

cool cnn site

But what if Watford offer JFK the job with a three year contract?

unless of course the Republicans steal the election http://www.truthout.org/110308A

Very solid choices - though you are cheating with Sir Terry of H

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2008/10/on-...nnsylvania.html I think McCain may be in a bit of trouble when the rednecks are voting for the black bloke

Or as fucking freaky. Richard Williams - even Freakier

Given how instrumental Afghanistan was in the US plan to bankrupt the Soviet Union, I'd have tried the best I could to steer well clear. So you'd have just left the Taliban in charge and allowed them to continue training ad infinitum then? Or would you have just nuked Afghanistan to a glass wasteland? (this is exactly what I mean by Obama probably not being able to sort things out tbh) Insofar as no one ever can? Agreed. No problem Obama is a Muslim so he will be able to sort out the Taliban

Is that real? Yup St Louis - he has done a few rallies with redic crowds

This obama fella can pull a crowd in

Given Venison, Woodgate, Albert, Beresford Asprilla, Beardsley, Lee, Ginola Shearer, Ferdinand

he won the championship this year with an inferior car to the Ferrari he had better pace than Alonso last year Alonso is far and away the best pound for pound driver on the current grid seems something of an exageration 'had better pace than Alonso last year' is an exageration - they finished equal on points and, had the FIA not got involved in what was quite clearly a team squabble in Hungary, Alonso would have beaten him. He didn't have better pace than Alonso, it was that he was expected to be destroyed by Alonso and when he wasn't, people assumed he must have had better pace. Suggesting that the McLaren is inferior to the Ferrari is ludicrous btw - the only advantage the Ferrari has is on tyre conservation. If you stuck them all in homogenised cars, Alonso would win IMO closely followed by the pack of Hamilton, Kubica, Vettel, Massa & Barrichello It ws the far and away I was disagreeing with, not if Alonso was better or not. I think it is interesting that Hamilton has won the Championship and only set two fastest laps. Added to that Kovaleinen being consistantly so far off the pace. That gave me the impression the Ferarri was the better package -I could well be wrong

he won the championship this year with an inferior car to the Ferrari he had better pace than Alonso last year Alonso is far and away the best pound for pound driver on the current grid seems something of an exageration

jesus

That's the stupidest thing i've ever read. Quality first post.

My glass half full position is that the horribleness of the second half is all due to the number of players who cant be match fit. Beye, Martins, Shola, Spidey Barton Enrique - none of them can be fully up to 90 minutes yet. Shola and Martins have had to come back and play three in a week

Shola won a load in the air in the first half. Sadly his most memorable moment in the second was falling over the ball after finding himself a load of space outside the box

Enrique worries me, he looks terrified to be on the pitch. I take it "The Bull" is from the Zico Martin school of nicknaming

This HAS to be a win game to lose this one will demoralise the players. To lose games on the trot like we are is like running in sand hard as fuck to get anywhere. A win is a step in the right direction to lose is another step towards the championship I think Alex's response was a bit more level headed. To call it MUST WIN suggests we should all just give up if we happen to get a draw. If we cant win this game, then what games DO we have a realistic chance of winning. Thats what makes this a must win