trophyshy

Atheism is a position. Here is the position of atheism. The evidence for the existence of a god is not sufficient. That's it. How is that hypocritical? Why should people not criticise something they think is not the truth? That's how we as a societies have progressed throughout time. It doesn't happen by sitting around saying, 'Well that seems like bullshit but I better not look for a better explanation because if I show up Gary he'll think I'm a dick'. You're being silly. I don't think you understand me here, i am not talking about normal atheists, i am talking about the ones who without understanding religion just say its bullshit, and try to force their views on people. Last i checked there isn't enough evidence to prove god doesn't exist either When these atheists group together they in a sense form a cult\ religion which is why i said they are hypocrites. So i wasn't being silly mate, its all about perception. Only by truly understanding bullshit can you call it religion. I can announce, fearlessly, that the existence of god or otherwise, will never be proven. Fair play then, just go on your instincts.

That is fucking brilliant.

Well I studied Eastern philosophy a bit in my MA so that got my interested, plus one of my best friends did a PhD in Ethics at Oxford and is a pretty strong Christian so he was always challenging me, particularly during my more nihilistic years Which begs the question then, did this 'stuff' save you from yourself, you vile animal?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyne_and_Wear

Thanks to the contributors to this thread, very interesting conversation. Sloop your encyclopaedic knowledge of the protagonists in this journey is impressive (and slightly bewildering), that much has to be acknowledged. Is this a personal interest or work/study related? Tell me to mind my own business if I'm twisting your free will. Seemingly nowt wrong with Muamba after 78 minutes of being dead. That's as close to miraculous as it gets tbf.

It's worked for me before, with some room for extra at weekends, thanks for the advice though.

Just put myself on 1100 calories a day after near 18 months of not giving a fuck. I seem to put on close to a pound for each month of ngaf. Should only take me 10 weeks to get it off again. A pretty good deal really.

All those in their societies, of their species yes. They compete with other societies of there own species, just as we do. I won't bore you with the numerous examples, but it is an extremely common phenomena. You must have seen David Attenborough on about it at some stage. And no animal has ever done anything as brutal as Hiroshima. We're just very bright animals that made a load of shit up, part of that shit was that we are special, not animals and someone is looking out for us. Society and civilisation are always in flux and have reverted too, but I'd say organising to build large structures is as good a measure of civilisation as any without a time machine. Göbekli Tepe is reported as being around 12,000 years old. I mostly agree with your final point, it's our potential that bugs me.

Erm.... Murdered,raped,enslaved, exploited minorities etc etc Always find it interesting hove those who are "humanist" deride religion which was the very catalyst for said humanity. All of those things have happened in the name of religion too, what's the common theme? Are you being interested by your belief that civilisation can only occur because of religion? Unprovable without a time machine, and you could argue religion has destroyed plenty along the way. Animals readily organise themselves into civilisations, for the greater good of all. How did these get going? Men and women have self organised into civilised society dozens perhaps even thousands of times all over Earth throughout thousands or indeed tens of thousands of years. There may have been numerous different religious elements to these systems, they may have been there at the beginning or developed as the result of having time to consider such matters by being freed from living hand to mouth, but what was the common theme through time and space? People. They create civilisations, they create religions, they create gods. Even if it were so that our invention of religion provided us with a stepping stone to civilisation it has also built walls between civilisations, literally, and ones that will seemingly never topple. If we could objectively acknowledge this phenomena for what it is we could begin to unpick the damage it does in today's society. But as it is closely associated with peoples' desire for meaning, love for their departed and the fact they have so much invested in it it would require such monumental effort, courage and determination, on an individual and group level, it's likely a lost cause. This makes me wonder if this happens with all intelligent civilisations or if any have broken free of this initial explanation tether. If they have perhaps they'd consider telling us how they did it, if we weren't still interested in blowing eachother, and most likely them, to Kingdom Come.

Kelsce Polish Nick will be delighted.

I'm arguing that free will wasn't even an idea back then, because it made no sense logically in their view of the world I'm also arguing that outside a Monotheistic view of the world free will doesn't exist - it's inherently as false a belief as the idea that Christ died for our sins But assuming the idea was spawned (or hijacked) by a religion, to what end, a land grab? Looks like these folks are starting to think for themselves, fucking hell! We better tell them that God bestowed that on them... OOH! NICE SAVE! I think before concepts of gods, be they pagan or otherwise, free will existed and was so tacit that it didn't need a label. You could put together a convincing argument that religion robbed us of free will. And citing anything written by people from 2000+ years ago, filtered by those in power with their human agendas, is inherently flawed as an explanation for anything. There are what can be interpreted as UFO's described in the bible, but believe in them and you're a nutter, even though people still see hundreds every year. Not faith based so rubbished. Faith based, well then..has to remain believed by many and unquestioned by most.

You never replied to my post in the other topic about religion If religion puts people in 'cages' then what does determinism do? I'm sorry Sloop I forgot all about that. Would you expand your question please...as I assume you have a view on what determinism does?

I'm praying for the increased revenues of Country Life butter.

Wait another 18 months man and we'll get £25m off Liverpool for him.

@PaddockLad I actually think someone has used that photo against me on here in the past, , so maybe a fair cop. Religion puts people in boxes, maybe even cages, does that not bother you? It's not like it is their free choice most of the time. If these things were all there to be selected after a good few years as a grown up then I'd go along with live and let live, it's indoctrination and inability to 'get out' that enslaves people, entrenches separatism, enhances conflict. Not exactly militant about it myself, but it is a huge and critical subject that deserves far more discussion and exploration. Anyway I want to join the cult of KSA, when he finally gets it going.

Whatever you say maaaan another cult btw Well given it's a conclusion I've reached on my own and I'm not currently recruiting young fitties I think I'm safe from the tanks shooting fire for now. I'd revise my statement to 'find your own path' for risk of being labelled a hippy again.

It's merely an awareness of your place in the cosmos and a desire to grow spiritually, with a small s. I'm aware plenty of people cgaf.

2000 year old collection of desert scribblings. You might as well have been a baby raper! With all due respect, FUCK RELIGION, have the courage and responsibility to accept you are here once and that if you share any time with anyone important it is a gift of chance, just as your life is. In the Congo they also have a fairly strong associated belief in witch doctors and kill people on the strength of this belief, should we respect that too? Beliefs based on nothing are massively dangerous as faith somehow manages to trump almost all other human constructs. Those militant atheists are trying to shake humanity from it's adolescent tethers, religions are the acne of our species and it's time to accept the Oxy 10 of collective responsibility, shared experience and universal truth. We are all one but religion, bizarrely and counter-productively, suggests the opposite. Religion, because of it close association with our 'meaning' or need for meaning has achieved an UNTOUCHABLE status, it's not even open for genuine debate as to what a load of old bollocks it is. Worse than the Royal Family which we all accept as being okay, no need for a debate about abolishing that archaic bullshit either (and at the minute is almost taking on cultish proportions itself). What is worse than that is it has wrestled for itself morality and spiritual growth, leaving the state to utterly ignore these things which is ABHORRENT. Why the fuck we don't do ANYTHING at all about genuine human growth, community responsibility, mutual understanding...it's just ignored and lumped in with being a worshipper of one or other things you are born into. Outrageous and demonstrates the state just want to educate you to be a cog in the machine, not to be a well rounded and beautiful spirit. Religion is adolescence. Cosmic spirituality is the path. Get well soon to anyone who falls ill, be they on television or homeless, rich or poor, black or white. Obviously. Pray to Science as it's done far more for humanity than any flying spaghetti monster ever has. Too much coffee, tbh.

Didn't you win namedropper of the year last year? Give someone else a chance man, KSA needs new material.

Sounds like this new lot are a bunch of fucking muppets too mate. Best start looking for a third role ASAP. [congrats btw, I think]

Is this not related to FFP? Won't all clubs be going for smaller more competitive squads?

Doesnt that imply they were a better player if they preferred Willo to play over Taylor? Maybe, I just feel dirty now.

To be fair I said preferred, the person in question did not say they were a better player.

I've had a look and seen who said they preferred Willo. Probably fitting then that they've done a bunk.