Rayvin

That utter bollocks might stand up if the issue here was people preferring Trump to Clinton - in left wing circles, that's not what's happening. People don't want either of them, and it's not because, ffs, she's a woman. This is why a healthy number of people were dismayed when she didn't choose Elizabeth Warren as her running mate. Going further, Warren as a presidential candidate would have been credible, well respected, and would have blown Trump apart. As would Sanders in truth, but given that we have to make this about identity politics, Warren is a better bet. The problem that the Huffington Post and (being honest) the Guardian have, both now so far up their own arses on identity politics that they've lost sight of what they're actually supposed to stand for, is that they keep framing this as people preferring Trump. Obviously a lot of people do. But that likely has more to do with his (believe it or not) positive stance and views, and his ridiculous promises. Sarah Palin could be running instead with a similar platform to Trump, and Hillary would be suffering from identical issues. In fact, I almost wish Palin was running so that we could dispense with this ridiculous identity politics nonsense once and for all. She's not in trouble here because she's a woman. Even for Trump supporters, while I daresay sexism might be a component for them if both candidates were equal on policy, they're clearly voting for what they think he will deliver, rather than voting for what gender he is. The real problem though, the absolute root issue, is that the current Western political system is failing too many people. On all sides, in most classes. This is why we have UKIP, Brexit, Corbyn, Sanders, Left and Right wing parties on the rise across Europe. This is not a gendered issue. Hillary is the middle of the road establishment stooge, and she's being battered for it.

I don't drink coffee at all myself - I've always been worried that if I start, I'll become dependent on it. Fair enough drinking decaffe though, if you just like the taste.

I see.

That's probably, depressingly, true.

It's not hatred I don't think, but effectively the US had a choice between someone actually left wing who would have helped people, and someone to the right of Theresa May on the payroll of Wall Street who is a demonstrable liar who by the sounds of it, should be prosecuted by the FBI - as their left wing candidates. It's the fact that the establishment, again, as usual, is going to win. Despite the shitshow on offer.

I am curious as to Corbyn's position on ISIS if it's not the same as Smith's though. Assuming Smith's is talking to them.

Political aides for leadership change speech for MP. That's animal farm? I think every government in history could be accused of being animal farm then. FFS Renton, there's some solid and meaningful criticisms to make of Corbyn but a lot of what you're going for is the sort of hysteria that the right wing press would go for. He isn't this demonic figure - he's a lefty and with traditional lefty ideas, and he is being opposed by half of his party, leading him to take steps to get things under control. This is fucking normal - this is what he should have been doing last year. If he doesn't do this, Labour will continue to struggle. I don't personally believe Corbyn is treating his MPs any differently, at present, to how May treats hers.

Momentum have a type now? Come off it man, people on all sides use the same arguing strategies.

With the caveat that I can also see Renton's side that, if you believe Islam to be a surpremacist ideology, then logically you would assume talking to them wouldn't work.

I'm just going to agree, essentially word for word, with NJS here.

That's just fucking rubbish but I 'd regardless.

Dunno like, can you recall any wars we've been involved in within the last 50 years that actually had our national security at stake?

Yeah but mine don't match, so I've missed the lowest of low bars for middle class-ness

RTG tearing itself apart over whether they should immediately jettison Moyes and bring Sam back

You're joking What an utter twat. Unbelievable.

Dude I gave you an out!

He could be using it the other way, and casually remarking that your version of events sounds very elaborate, and that thus, by implication, he is suspicious of it.

Holy fuck.

A built in vacuum cleaner...? Built into what, your arm? WTF is a built in vacuum cleaner

Oh this is gonna be excellent, isn't it

Which fucking 9?

Woah, hold on I have none of those things, what does that make me Contrast this with a BBC poll that decided I was part of 'the elite', i think we can safely say that these things are nonsense.

Pulis likely to be one. I reckon the club that they're talking about as having helped their investigation is probably West brom.

Aye but watching Pardew crash and burn would be about as satisfying. We'd get to watch the two of them burn for the price of one.

The Telegraph has started publishing more. Apparently BSA has also called HMRC the most corrupt business [sic] in the UK. In fairness that's just an opinion but as a PR thing, it's pretty interesting. I reckon the Telegraph is trying to get him sacked here like, they'll keep publishing while this 'meeting' goes on.