Rayvin

:lol:

I imagine that's the kind of sentiment that resulted in her doing what she does

Aye, don't think we can criticise them for that call.

I just want to add the following classic from the Guardian, to enrich this debate: How Thomas the Tank Engine is racist. And sexist. And other things. https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jul/22/thomas-the-tank-engine-children-parents

That vid is very true tbf. With the caveat, as ever, that there remains no rational reason for anyone at the bottom to vote Tory. Le Pen and Trump make more sense.

Interesting. But you think she's aiming for next time? I don't think the issues will go away so I suppose that's a reasonable strategy for her. World might move on though. Hopefully the left proposes some meaningful solutions that don't involve being insanely far right.

Le Pen is, curiously, more pro-State than Macron. That's a weird one actually - totally supports the idea that he's a Neo-liberalist I guess but rather compromises the view that he is centre-left, I would have thought?

What a world we live in.

Then we're going to be re-running this scenario in 5 years time. But I guess it keeps the EU going for a bit at least. Maybe we can sort our own problems out by then and be in a stronger position when the inevitable does come to pass.

Ok but every post on here is arguably a waste of time by that measure. I find the intellectual stimulation of open debate to be worthwhile though.

Yep. Dunno why the inconsistencies and failures of the system shouldn't be pointed out at every available opportunity though. Especially when the self same system has us Brexiting. And has the yanks in the clutches of an absolute headcase.

Do people really just sit there as you climb over them? Fair enough keeping the aisle seat but surely they could just stand up and let you access the other one easily.

Centre doesn't always means establishment - establishment is the same tired political parties in the same battles with the same policies. In fairness I know nothing about Macron's policies but it does sound like more of the same.

Why would that be a reason not to moan about it? I would say that scenario would be one of the most compelling reasons to complain, frankly.

I both agree and disagree with that last statement. Well actually probably more agree than not. It seems as though Hollande has correctly identified the mood of the country and picked Macron (handpicked, apparently) to be his successor, even if it means playing outside of the party line. It's actually refreshing to see that kind of thing as it suggests that politicians in France are actually concerned about France, rather than their own party. But yes, he's a neolib through and through. But if he has popular support while claiming to be an outsider who can shake things up, it means that the establishment has realised it has to play a different game now. That said, if he continues with the same policies I expect this is just an exercise in kicking the can down the road. Hopefully he's someone of substance who can actually improve people's lives.

Maybe some of the extreme left-wing guy's votes will go her way. Depends on the extent to which left vs right wing politics is still relevant I suppose.

So we have the far right and an independent who has never run for election before. Another kicking for the establishment, really. Both of France's main parties ejected at the first round. For the first time since WW2.

It only becomes an issue when their actions have real world consequences, certainly. Such people tend to be part of groups like antifa for instance. Similarly these will be the people who defend Islam when terrorism strikes. The only real concern for me is their move to control academia. Converting universities into safe spaces rather than institutions where people can learn. Agree on Milo although he couldn't exist without them. In fact, none of the people you name dropped could do. And those people are influencing then minds of others. Sargon for instance convinces many of his fans to vote leave, because it would strike a blow against political Islam. They all feed off each other man and it's beyond tedious. EDIT - Just FYI, I don't care about the avatars change. It was just a useful example of virtue signalling for the purposes of answering the question posed.

Macron and Le Pen both through to the final run off in France. Sounds Like Macron should win convincingly. That said, she seems to have won the most votes in the first round.

It was a response to the Rees Mogg post Meenz made which I couldn't bring myself to quote because he'd then be all over this page too. Appreciate that it could come straight out of any of the politics threads though

As for the point about people voting for the right, well, yeah. I can't explain to you why the Tories keep getting votes, I've been reduced to concluding that the vast majority of people simply follow what the papers say on the matter. But I can see that the left loses them based on stuff like this, especially in younger generations. This stuff is becoming a problem along with the right wing reaction to it.

I didn't actually mention it on here though I knew I'd regret that I just thought you'd like to know who was donating.

Not come across that one before but that's absolutely the level they're descending to The problem with all of this (for me) isn't that I think it's stupid (I do, but who cares what I think), it's that these people are how many ordinary people see 'the left'.