Rayvin

Apparently I need to watch this.

Them and the PLP. I've noticed with interest the Guardian's u-turn over Corbyn in recent weeks. Although I want to set out that Corbyn's views won't appeal to everyone if not filtered through the media. The 1% for instance.

I see, so you think the only reason anyone is ever elected to anything is entirely to do with the person themselves, with no mitigating circumstances surrounding the event whatsoever. Brown - unelectable. Miliband - unelectable. Churchill - unelectable. To hell with details

I don't think he's unelectable based on any logical or rational measure. He's only unelectable based on a media hysteria measure. That said, I still think he's done well in the face of it.

As I said earlier, I think it'll be between a hung parliament and a 60 seat majority, since that seems to be what the polls are saying. I am under no illusions about the fact that he won't win, and never have been. That said, he's performed far, far better than I expected him to.

You and I both know that the policies poll well across the electorate, and that the only reason this doesn't manifest in actual elections is because of media spin about non-issues. I can't help that and refuse to water down my views based on what some fucknut at the Mail may or may not say about it. There's a rationality gap in voting, and it's sad. But the answer isn't to compromise.

Hence winning two leadership elections and fighting off the media, the PLP and the Tories to make a decent showing of this campaign. Or are we saying that he has suddenly 'become' electable in the past month? Impressive transformation if so.

No one was going for him on policy at the start. Everyone was rattling on about how unelectable he was, based on absolutely fuck all.

The point is he's reset where the discussion is. Something I hoped he would do 2 years ago when I voted him in. That manifesto never would have come to pass without him, and that's the area in which the PLP have misunderstood what's going on. You've said yourself that globalisation was/is the big challenge of our time - when on earth have the PLP given any indication that they have even the faintest awareness of the challenges people are facing there? Their failure to understand what people wanted led to Corbyn. If Yvette Cooper had been putting forward half of what Corbyn was, I could have voted for her.

Well said.

Aye but even you have to admit that the PLP misreading of the public mood and constant attempts to undermine the guy have damaged Corbyn. He's had to face his own party, the media and the Tories. In fact, of all three I'd say the Tories landed the fewest blows.

The country is going to be in tatters in 5 years either way, irrespective of who is in charge. Unless you think there's some deal that can be struck that actually doesn't torpedo the economy?

They'd have to change the voting mechanism for that to work though, and even if they could manage that, would they have the balls to do it? The party would absolutely haemorrhage members. Even the longstanding ones would surely have to reconsider based on how successful this campaign seems to have been. We'll have to see how it goes, but I think if nothing else this election campaign will have severely damaged any hopes the PLP had of people just letting them take the party back to the centre.

Aye it's a grim thought, but on the other hand, this is a poisoned chalice of an election if ever there was one. There is realistically very little any party can do to make a success of Brexit, and I'm not going to be entirely unhappy if it's the Tories who have to handle (and pay for) that. But yes, 5 years is a fucking long time.

Not much campaign left to damage now, it's over tomorrow. They've sidelined her for precisely the reason you've set out, but for my view it's not going to make much difference. The polls haven't moved noticeably for a few days, which means that the only hope we have is literally the youth vote. Best case scenario, that pegs Labour level with the Tories. Worst case scenario, the Tories get their 60 seat majority. Looks like the majority is inevitable based on that but I think if we can redo this in 5 years time, the policies will win out.

Steady now, that sounds like an allusion to the MSM. Not a popular concept in these parts

Absolutely this.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jun/06/yvette-cooper-personal-attack-theresa-may-armed-police-cuts Yvette getting involved. Good.

To what end though? What would they have to do to inspire trust from your mate?

HF mentioned Obama spent his way out. Don't worry, Corbyn's in good company on this.

Aye but I guess you can't have everything...

Aye, and Labour were wrong to follow the Tories down that line. Unfortunately, the media bought and paid for the narrative, so all political parties had to bend to it. I mean, the Tories see it as their core ideology, but the LDs and Labour should never have followed them. Which is why the Labour Blairites were punished in the leadership election.

Yep, the long game. We obliterate the ideology by perverting its people with our own culture. Sex, money, greed and decadence will do for Islam in the same way it did for Christianity.

Vote Labour and the government get them all back again under renationalisation