Rayvin

Appreciated, but it was a useful contrast in the wider context of the argument.

Yeah I just edited in Ken Clarke for my previous post - but for the others, I don't know.

I described him as 'appearing' to be. I used that exact word.

He appears more principled than any other Tory, to me (low bar, but still). He appears very principled to the right, which is why they are rallying around him. This is why he is a problem for us. EDIT - Actually, I forgot Ken Clarke exists. So he doesn't get the 'than any other Tory' bit.

Can we all agree that there is a difference between being principled, and appearing principled? Is that possible?

Who cares what they are? He's perceived as sticking to them and the abortion one is a good example of it. All of what you said about Corbyn is true, none of it changes my point about why he was elected as leader of the party. I didn't say I admire JRM. This was my original post: Where does it say I admire that? I've merely pointed out that politicians who talk honestly and don't hide from what they believe, appear to be the 'in thing'. From a strategic point of view, that's worth keeping in mind. Personally, I do believe that sticking to ones principles is important and valuable. As do you. My position on that particular consideration doesn't change based on the context of the opinion, and I don't know why it would. It would in fact just make me a hypocrite who doesn't stick to my own principles ffs. But it doesn't mean I admire the man or what he stands for, or that he continues to stick to them. Sticking to your principles is good; not all principles are good. I think it's possible to hold both beliefs... I believe Rees-Mogg is a cunt.

Well no because as far as I can recall, Tim Farron lied about his views on religion or at least kept flip flopping on the issue. That's kind of the opposite to Rees-Mogg in this context. I'm going to start adding the following disclaimer to help people read my arguments properly: I believe Rees-Mogg is a cunt.

Yours is an emotionally charged position. His principles are his principles, and imposing a personal moral judgement on them changes nothing about my argument. I don't admire him in any way, but those who share or have sympathy with his principles, do. Not everyone has the same set of principles ffs. And Corbyn was successful in getting elected because he stuck to his principles and voters perceived him as being a man they could finally trust. Whether he has effectively done that as leader is irrelevant. It's a key reason he is where he is. And whether Rees-Mogg will stick to his while in power is irrelevant, if the perception gets him over the line. And this is absolutely how he is perceived. I can see we're heading for the same "How could this happen" as we did with Trump tbh.

It's a step further than the vast, vast majority of our MPs would be prepared to go. Look, I'm not saying the guy is anything other than a sneering, out of touch rich kid who is presumably stuck in a bubble made up entirely of people who smoke pipes and wear monocles, but if we are to understand why the man is popular, and a threat, we need to at least look at his strengths. And he is riding a similar wave with the right to the one Corbyn rode with the left.

He has nothing to gain politically by sticking to his Catholic view on abortion. That only hurts his ambitions.

Formidable argument I've said as much before tbh, it's not a new position. The guy was grilled over his anti-abortion position and stood by it. He's been grilled over his Brexit position and stood by it. He is far more honest about what he believes in than most politicians, especially on the Tory side. Happy to take evidence to the contrary though. And I should add that my acknowledgement that he appears to stick to his principles is not an endorsement of said principles.

Interesting video - I don't know if NBC cut this section although it seriously wouldn't surprise me - but this is Putin IMO confirming that they did mess up the US elections (while denying it), and stating confidently why we're in no position to say anything about it, really:

We're all united on JRM it seems, but it's worth noting that he appears to be uncompromising on his principles, relatively honest about what they are, and prepared to stand by them. Not unlike Corbyn - and popular with the right wingers for the same reason. Another sign perhaps that if the centre could just get someone who had an actual backbone, we wouldn't be in this mess.

Tbf it sounds like that might be 60% of our overall budget.

I mean I look back at it with amusement now tbh. I made more of an effort with Bloodborne and must have got about 3 or 4 hours in before giving up. I just can't stand having being relegated back to a checkpoint I passed 30 minutes ago and redoing the whole thing. Plus it punished you for not finding your dead remains or dying before you got back to them. Coupled with a lack of patience which meant I would try to speed through the sections I had worked through previously before dying (and inevitably take more damage due to carelessness), it's just not for me. I'm not the kind of person who should play these games

Wait, so you're not meant to be fearful? The game punishes you really hard for dying. I 'fondly' recall the 30 minutes I spent playing Dark Souls. Started in a prison cell with a broken sword. Left cell. No idea about combat. Skeleton with non-broken sword appears, stabs me, I die. Restart game, remember where skeleton is, practice a few sword swings, kill skeleton, move further down passage, another skeleton, I die. Restart, kill both skeletons, enter a bigger room, see a huge ogre demon thing that looks like some kind of boss and has a club the size of a small country, it looks at me, I die. Repeat, get a few swings in, do no damage at all, I die. Try to go around it, go onto a high ledge, try to jump attack down onto it, Succeed, damage it heavily, but die in the fall. Etc. It just wasn't fun

Which is how? I find them incredibly tedious so this information would be useful because i do actually want to enjoy them.

Tbf that sounds worse than Trump.

Aye but we as a nation understand that the UK isn't the be all and end all of the world. Something that seems to be lost on many Americans vis-a-vis their own country. If the US is the sum total of your universe, why would you need to know what it looked like?

He's right though. People voted for an absolute clusterfuck when they voted Brexit, and when they voted for May. It is what it is, and while politicians are responsible for lying to people, voters are responsible for being dumb enough to be lied to.

Even if Labour weren't divided, it's hard to imagine them doing anything of substance. Corbyn genuinely does seem to think that his current approach of simply standing back and leaving the collapse of the Tories to chance, is going to work. And tbf to him it might, but he really doesn't fucking deserve for it to do so.

Signed it mostly just to have an artificial feeling that I've achieved something.

Agreed.

Indeed. Those Labour MPs man, just what the fuck. What the fuck.

He has managed it rarely, but my point is more that usually PMQs is just total farce and entirely irrelevant. This time it really does matter, he really does have a chance to turn the screw at a time when Labour have a 5 point lead in the polls. This time it has to count.