Rayvin

I believe she'll stay, but am positive her deal will not. I really don't know why you have such faith in her on this. Are you that desperate not to be wrong about all of this that you're blinding yourself to the most likely outcomes? As much as I wanted Corbyn to renew Labour, i had to accept that it just hasn't worked. What is it going to take with you and May? She's literally going to have to have her head on a pike outside parliament for you to think she's lost, by the sounds of it.

Yeah there have been some Lib Dems saying that as well but CT, there just isn't enough of them to get past Labour, the SNP, and the ERG.

Having said this, they seem to be pushing for this outcome also. To make it stick they need one of them to take the PM position. If they pull down Mays deal and replace it with nothing, thwy could lose everything. Although truthfully, many of them may prefer Remain to Mays deal.

She'll resign if her deal is voted down. It's her out. No way she'll have the stones to preside over a no deal outcome. If she resigns, we get no deal by JRM or the moderate Tories force through a public vote.

He 100% won't get an election. Although i did read yesterday that if enough Tories join a vote of no confidence in the government, combined with Labour and the other parties they can force one.

May overcomes fuck all. She keeps going with grim determination, I'll grant her that, but its not the same as overcoming, which suggests she will win out somehow. The only reason she is still PM is because the Tories need someone to be the fall guy for this.

I love this fabled PR drive CT keeps talking about. Who is going to lead that exactly? She's lost Gove, Johnson, Raab, Davis... Farage will come out of the woodwork as well. There is going to be hell on, CT. If the Remainers think they can pull off a second vote, she's fucked. The only chance she has, is continuing to convince them that it's her deal or no deal. Weirdly, they're the only ones who might save her. But they'd be fucking stupid to do so when a second vote is feasible.

https://twitter.com/BBCNormanS/status/1063072940743376897

I am not off to France 100% I have no immediate plans to leave, I just know I will if it becomes clear that the country is doomed.

Yep. No Deal gives the Tories no escape. May's Deal means they'll fudge their way out of this. Also, May's deal means Brexit will happen and I'm prepared to risk No Deal for a shot at Remain.

I'm not disputing that.

The only way to what? I'm not disregarding that other ways are possible, I'm just saying that if I can't have 'remain', I'd rather have 'No Deal' than 'May's Deal'. I'm not sure why this is bothering you so much ewerk It's not like I have the power to make it happen.

Yeah but that still rules in almost every politician, of any stripe, in the country.

Do we want May to be overthrown though? I can't quite see all ends of this. If she is, her deal is dead - I doubt the Tories will elect JRM, but they will elect someone like Javid or Gove. What would they do?

I'm not talking about going left though, we can go back central for all I care after this - but the Tories do need to pay

I have sympathy, as I said - just not enough to outweight my overarching feeling that the Tories need to be made to suffer for this. Which, IMO, will do the country the world of good in the long run anyway.

I'm not convinced Corbyn will survive this either unless he goes in heavily on a people's vote, tbh...

@Christmas Tree , which one would you choose?

Kate Hoey says the deal is a sell out. I mean this just isn't getting through Parliament. No way in hell. So it's No Deal or No Brexit.

Agreed.

They cannot be allowed to do this - I mean they inevitably will, but they need to suffer consequences for this. Something needs to change, surely.

She chose to take it. She continues to choose not to resign and simply admit that remaining is the best option.

I'm monumentally pissed off with her this morning.

Don't you dare feel sorry for her.

I'm just done with the compromise (not that I hold any power in this at all). Looking at it rationally, if No Deal is simply unthinkable, then call the government's bluff. Force them into a position where it's No Deal or Remain. The Tories are then fucked either way. I would argue more fucked under No Deal.