Rayvin

Agreed on that, although a move towards a Norway would still be acceptable IMO.

Well, looking at it logically, if I can't vote for an MP that has a grounding in normal life + good policies, then I may as well vote for one with good policies. If you'd asked me a couple of years ago then I think the 'ordinary guy' thing would have been less significant - having seen the total failure of someone who has 'good policies' and still seems to willfully throw the country over the cliff edge for the sake of a political gain, I say again, I can see PL's view.

Nothing.

I recall a great deal of frustration with George Osborne about the fact he was the chancellor on the back of having a history degree and never having worked a day in his life in terms of ordinary jobs. I don't know how true the idea that she will lose her seat at the next GE is, but surely that weakens your position if true, suggesting that people vote for parties instead of individuals (which I personally feel is mostly true with some exceptional outliers). And again, PL (without putting words in his mouth, but we seem fairly aligned atm) is talking about her being a symbol of the general malaise and disconnect between parliament and the public. Maybe some grounding in what it's actually like to live under most of their policies as a normal person would be a useful experience for many MPs. Whether the public vote for her or not, as we see with Brexit, does not mean they're necessarily voting in their interests.

If he's opposed to her as an MP because she's 'from another planet' as far as the electorate are concerned, why are you trying to determine if he supports her positions or not? You're talking about a metric he isn't even referencing. Clearly for some people, recognising the normality of their MPs in terms of modern living is important. It's why Theresa May attempts to play pool and fake being human.

Well yeah

Obviously really hope they do get Rodgers but we're only going to dodge this bullet for so long.

God damn. Well played by the other guy to just divert around Trump's fucking stupidity while giving him something he can cling onto to save face.

Is your wife ITK?

They did beat Bristol tbf.

Aye if it continues like this it's a rare endorsement of Ashleys strategy.

They'll just run it through an appeal process, get it delayed and then splurge this summer. It'll be like nothing happened.

It doesnt matter to me if it would have happened or not in terms of my faith in Corbyn. His stance so far is an absolute betrayal of the membership. I mean let's remember that 65% of Labour voters (not members) voted Remain. 65%. The membership 90% wants a second referendum. He's thrown all of that away in order to pick up the non voting malcontents who delivered Brexit to us. They aren't his responsibility though, his responsibility is Labour voters and members. It's pathetic.

It seems like this is having a positive impact on Corbyn concerning a second referendum. Not that i have any idea how such a thing might be achieved now.

The media bombard my phone every day..?

Tbh I'm not saying we give him the benefit of the doubt, I'm just saying that he's a reflection of Labour's fucking stupid Brexit stance. I mean even the ones who have a prepared answer are just talking in soundbites. One thing I will note is that I got a fucking load of PR texts from him in the run up - and heard absolutely nothing about the other guy. So this guy was at least very fucking visible to me. Not that I voted, but still.

Not going to disagree with that but for all I know that could be his first time in front of the cameras. He seemed to be panicking.

Well aye but he's a local politician. Also, honestly, I've never rated politicians as being particularly intelligent over and above say, a fair number of us on here. I daresay we could outperform them comfortably.

Nobody is telling the truth and he's a junior politician. His career would be over in a heartbeat if he started telling the truth.

He's clearly a remainer who, with the backing he has received from Momentum, is trying to find a nice way around getting out of the question. Hardly makes him an idiot, just a reflection of Labour's fucking stupid position. What he probably should have said is 'Labour's position on this has been quite clear - we want a Brexit that works for most people, and that includes a customs union. As things stand, I am very opposed to the Brexit options available as I feel that all of them will deliver a bad deal for the North East. I voted to remain in the referendum, but respect the result of the vote as long as it does not cause intense damage to the UK and on working people's lives'. Something like that anyway - but he looks new to this shit.

I'm aware, trust me.

I doubt they'll survive No Deal either tbh. If it's as bad as what we're all picturing there will be actual hell on. Incidentally, at that point we need to be consistent on a narrative - whatever you think about Corbyn's failure on this, the blame has to be fucking squarely aimed at the Tories. No negotiation on it, not 'well some of it was the EU, a lot of it was a lack of leadership from Corbyn' etc - while all true, it waters the point down. It has to be 'This is on the fucking Tories'. The left will, however, find a way to fail at controlling this narrative.

I don't think she has time to deliver the fewer red lines now though - I mean even if she did try, it's hard to imagine them being well thought through. I am staggered that anyone has ever considered the Tories to be competent at anything btw, just staggered. There needs to be some fucking honesty with the public: "This has been an unmitigated disaster, we were poorly prepared and carried everything out incorrectly. The risk now if we proceed is that there are real and serious consequences for the lives of all British people, job losses and shortages of vital products. The only responsible action for us to take here is to cancel Article 50, and then as a nation, come together and decide what it is we want to do. We agreed that Brexit needs to happen and we will honour that agreement, but the nature of the Brexit requires public input as well - we will table a referendum for soft brexit or May's deal. No deal will be taken off the table because it is too destructive. We are sorry that you have been misled about the feasibility of this endeavour in general, and ask that you accept an apology on behalf of all MPs for our failure in this regard." I think the majority of the public would get behind that, and I even ruled our Remain on the referendum ticket so that the Brexiters don't think they're being shafted.

How is Theresa May possibly going to look at presiding over No Deal and the absolute fucking hell that would produce, and think that this is worth it. She cannot be that much of a psycho. Unless she literally fucking resigns the moment her deal gets knocked on the head and fucking hell, I can almost see it actually. Her deal voted down, no deal all but a certainty, May resigns, Parliament is a shambles, we'd have... fucking who in control? Who becomes leader by default? We'd inevitably have to go for a GE at that point. You would fucking hope that Parliament would cancel A50 as a matter of national security, but do any of them have the stones to do so? That's it though tbh - I think she'll just resign if her deal doesn't go through.