Rayvin

Yeah I keep seeing that statement doing the rounds and I find it mystifying. Labour will give us a second vote, which will very probably result in Remain. If it doesn't, I'm not sure any of us have any leg to stand on. Even I accept it at that point, but the second vote, IMO, is basically Remain.

Agree that there's no chance of a Labour majority but the aim was always a Remain majority.

what do you mean "gets better"? It sounds good so far or something?

Proof that it needs privatization.

Someone in the comments under that saying that if they've used standard class differentiators then the working class band also includes all pensioners, well off or otherwise. Can only hope that's true but i doubt such a misleading data set would be published if it is.

What the actual fuck are the working class doing.

I'm genuinely not saying that Corbyn and Labour shouldn't be reciprocating, but stopping Brexit is the LDs raison d'etre at this point. After all of this, if Labour lose, I actually think it'll be blamed on Swinson - and the reason for that is that she has completely failed to appreciate that a good 8 or 9% of their current polling is borrowed from Labour because of Brexit. She already has the Labour Remainers, but she's going to lose them pretty fucking quickly if she refuses to make headway on this issue. Now, they'll likely just go back to Labour which you would think would be fine except that we need them to vote for LD candidates in some places. And it honestly seems to me that she's starting to make that difficult for some of them. I appreciate she needs the Tory vote in certain places and maybe there's an informal arrangement in the backroom between the two, but she needs that deal more than Corbyn does. Frankly, I'm not even convinced Corbyn is that arsed about any of this now. He'll be off if he loses for certain, and I doubt he'll give any of this shit a second thought.

I cling to this notion too, but the idea of not standing aside for Labour in remain seats pours cold water on it to a degree. She can stand aside, advocate for remain, and still appeal to Tory moderates.

Still think its more on her. In the end, Brexit is merely another issue for Labour, whereas it's the be all and end all for the LDs. I couldn't name you a single LD policy other than revoking A50. Swinson is a minor party leader with delusions of grandeur and if it costs remain the win here she'll be resigning and swiftly followed by a poll collapse for the LDs back to around 10% Labour should absolutely be reciprocating too, but they're a major party. If they start standing people down they become a minor party, leaving the conservatives free to claim that they are indeed the one true party of governance. Maybe we have to take the LDs at their word and determine that they would be happy to work with BJ over Corbyn. Perhaps that's why this won't happen.

So are the Tories trying to do a deal with Farage now? If so I think we're really in trouble. Swinson continues to refuse to entertain the notion of working with Corbyn which, as Labour is far and away the bigger party, is actually on her. It's also on her because she has nailed her cock to the mast of remain. I simply do not understand this idea that Labour aren't a viable remain option, it's a damaging lie. And it's landing with some remainers.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jun/01/perfect-storm-austerity-behind-130000-deaths-uk-ippr-report 130k deaths under the Tories.

Who cares, it hurts the Tories.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/nov/13/mccluskey-tells-corbyn-defy-calls-extend-freedom-of-movement McCluskey telling Corbyn to refuse to put FOM on the table. Whether he believes that or not, if he wants to win this election, now is the last fucking time to think about bringing it up FFS. I don't understand this pathological determination to self-harm within Labour, it would be fascinating if it wasn't so incredibly infuriating.

WTF is she doing, seriously.

Doesn't include NHS workers apparently But yes, me too.

I think he should have stood up to him as well - just has to do it once in the campaign and it'll stick for enough people.

I think it's the £1.2tn thing from the Tories personally, at least in terms of potential impact.

On the other hand, Corbyn is a terrorist sympathiser still:

I really hope he's out meeting "the people" more this election.

There's quite a few of them saying that the team that just lost 3-0 to a side fighting relegation in L2 was "their best 11". How long until Carlisle are legitimately our regional rivals based on club stature?

Seems to be costing them in the polls though. Down to 15%. This could just get silly from here tbh. If it turns out that the Liberals cost us the seats required to stop the Tories it's yet another betrayal of their voter base. Unless they really do think they're going to become the soft Tory party. Hopefully the swing to Labour represents LDs who recognise that they have to vote tactically. That message, at least, seems to be getting through.

That's an insane position. Although tbh I have noticed that a decent number of remain voters have utterly no idea what Labour's position is. I find that surprising and clearly it's a LP failure to convey the message clearly, but these are supposed to be well educated people who take an active interest... the ones abandoning Labour for the LDs at least.

Dear god Just been over to RTG - apparently they need to sack the manager, the board and clear out the rotten core. It's like a re-run of their halcyon days in the PL.

It is hard to imagine what they think they're going to gain there.