Rayvin

Aye, if only the Labour party before Corbyn had listened to the warnings about austerity, maybe we wouldn't be here. Although Brexit would have happened anyway of course since the desire to issue an anti-establishment kick in the bollocks would have existed still been there.

https://www.nybooks.com/daily/2020/01/13/the-center-blows-itself-up-care-and-spite-in-the-brexit-election/ This article is superb and well worth a read even though it's long. Even covers Rentons feelings about the current direction of the Labour Party. Key point though is that the faction that took the heaviest hammering in this election was the centre. Not the left.

What does the party that represents you look like then? I bet it's not a million miles off where most of the candidates are standing politically.

Yeah tbf, if you really care about any of this you need to sign up and vote for someone other than RLB. Gloom is right, no point bitching on in here if you don't. If you don't, you'll be to blame for the next 10 years of Tory rule /Renton. I don't think her victory is a formality, it looked to me like she wins the first round and Starmer wins the second. I'll vote Starmer in the end probably but could also go for Nandy.

Actually starting to pay attention to Lisa Nandy a bit, at least now that she's saying the same things I am EDIT - the rest of you should take that as a cue to write her off btw

Anyone checked in on HF recently? Is he doing ok?

You don't do anything about it. Same as pointing out US adventurism and imperialism. You don't do anything about that either. Corporate greed and climate change? Don't do shit on those. Even Russia now, interfering in almost every democratic exercise that plays out across our nation? Ignore it. Play it safe. I'm more than happy to purge the antisemites out of the party, and for the exodus of the hard left, if it wins us power - and with the election of Starmer, we could achieve this. But I'm not going to pretend that I find this direction particularly inspiring, or that I'm going to be especially hopeful about the future. Let's see where we are after another 10-15 years of the Tories, I guess.

Only the Israeli agent in the article I linked to formally admitting it.

Suppose so. But then what do we do about Israeli interference in our political structures? Actually nevermind, I know the answer to that already.

Yeah but the Tories are an entirely different party in mindset. Their primary concern, come what may, is power - I suspect that goes right down to the membership. Labour's membership is more ideological. Just different people with different priorities.

Well, I see what you're saying on one side, but on the other, as you say, Israel is one of several powers which tries to interfere with foreign democracies. Specifically, within the Labour Party. And so what I'm saying is that given that we know Israel is interfering with shit in the Labour Party, it's not entirely surprising that people within the Labour party are jumping at shadows. Asking Jewish people to condemn Israel as some kind of proof I agree is ludicrous - but there are some stupid people on the left as well as on the right. And far too many purists. Indeed. Without wishing any harm on them, we have enough hell going on in this country to be able to turn a blind eye to Palestine - at least as the Labour Party. We aren't in power, we can't do anything about it, let it fucking go. The Tories are the ones who should worry about that shit, not that they will.

If it's any consolation, there is some robust discussion going on in some of the Labour Party groups I'm part of on this point, with a number of posts now coming up saying that Israel and Palestine isn't a focal issue and should just be dropped. It may be too late for those who are passionate about it. Some of them talking about heading to the Greens. I don't think they'll win this particular fight. One way or another, we need to get rid of this and get back to attacking the Tories and their media, and not each other.

Ok but, Israel has admitted to trying to influence Labour policy and indeed apparently has successfully achieved the ousting of MPs for anti-Israel views, according to they themselves: Among the MPs that Masot and Strizzolo discussed “taking down” was Sir Alan Duncan, a foreign minister and a vocal supporter of a Palestinian state. In the latest recordings, Masot boasts of establishing organisations “in Israel and here [in the UK]”. When asked what he means, the Israeli official replies: “Nothing I can share, but yeah,” adding: “Yeah, because there are things that, you know, happen, but it’s good to leave those organisations independent. But we help them, actually.” It's not happened in a vacuum. We might actually need to acknowledge that to be able to restore this. Although maybe a purge simply is the quickest way through it now. I don't care, frankly, as long as this ceases to be an issue.

Have posted it before, but this is why that happens: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/jan/08/israeli-diplomat-shai-masot-plotted-against-mps-set-up-political-groups-labour So it's not like these views and fears are coming from nothing. The problem is, they need to stand down or we'll never get anywhere. Israel just doesn't matter within British politics. It's not a battleground. A Labour victory at an election would be far more annoying to Israel than all this bitching and moaning.

This has to be the most obvious mackem we've ever had, including the ones who just announced they were mackems from the start. I recall a few weeks back when "marra" slipped into one of his posts hits every mackem stereotype going despite his efforts to go under the radar.

Bloody good thing their owner ignored them though when they were out for blood. If he'd listened to those dumbfucks they'd have sacked the guy and still been ambling pointlessly around midtable. Once again the fans would have been front and centre of the damage. Instead they've been saved by the owner they've forced into selling up. For their sake, I hope the next owner realises that he should pay no attention to them whatsoever. Seems to be the best way to run that particular club.

He maybe couldn't have done anything yesterday but is it not his fault that we're in this position through weeks of poor decision making on the injury front? Or do you think it was all unavoidable..?

Under Ashley.

Looks like they might be turning it around mind. Seems the fans were wrong as usual, good thing their owner ignored them I guess. They should be grateful that their mindless gibbering wasn't paid any heed.

Wonder what Shefki Kuqi is up to these days...

I think the sentence should be whatever is sufficient to rehabilitate people, either shorter or longer than the current guidelines based on the individual. If that means some people who remain a danger to the community never get out, then so be it. But you're right about it inevitably being reduced, especially since she's a woman.

I agree that the monarchy isn't a big issue at this point tbf. It's something to float when you have a majority the size of Johnson, not when you're trying to win power by attempting to establish "progressive patriotism". But ffs man, we can't let the right wing nutjobs silence our actual debates out of fear of what the press will weaponise against us on future. They really have won if that happens.

It's a weird case indeed this one. What do you think a more appropriate sentence would have been? 8 years is fairly lengthy by our standards.

He's appealing to Labour members here, not the wider country. He doesn't need those psychologically attached to the notion of servitude to vote for him at this point.

So Iran shot down the plane, according to the releases coming out now. And apparently will hand over the black boxes. They responded to the killing of their general by lightly grazing some US bases and killing 100 Iranians plus 70 or so others, none of whom were American. Pathetic.