Happy Face

I do have an issue with the writer and the paper involved...but I only brought that up in one post. Elsewhere I've stuck to the content of this article. As prime minister he should apologise on behalf of the nation. A government voted in by living British citizens sent other citizens of it's own abroad to be used and abused as an exercise in cutting welfare costs. If you agree an apology is deserved, who should give it, if not the current PM? And where have you seen evidence of anyone whose thinking on Gordo has been changed following this apology? I've not seen one commentator fooled by this so-called 'masking' of other issues.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=206...aODA&pos=11 I agree with the second half of that sentence. The question is, to what degree though? We do tolerate inequality, but the gap is widening. The average income for the 95th percentile has more than trebled from $60,000 to $200,000 since 1950 while the 20th percentile has only grown from just under $20,000 to just over $20,000... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:United_S...n_1947-2007.svg Well that's the 64,000 dollar question isn't it? I'd like more equality, particularly at the top end. I believe European systems achieve this better than the USA, probably Japan is better too. The most disappointing legacy of New Labour is they've been unable to adress these imbalances although I do believe they at least tried. The bold bit is the main point. When a Goldman Sachs employee says "we have to tolerate the inequality as a way to achieving greater prosperity and opportunity for all." he's using a broad market principle we can all agree with about wealth driving growth to defend the 60% increase in inequality and to advocate further increasing the income gap...driving millions into poverty. As you say, Labour did manage to level it off a tad, even lowering it for a period after the Tories created the greatest widening of the gap in the 80's, but it's back on the rise...

Spoon - Ga Ga Ga Ga Ga

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=206...aODA&pos=11 I agree with the second half of that sentence. The question is, to what degree though? We do tolerate inequality, but the gap is widening. The average income for the 95th percentile has more than trebled from $60,000 to $200,000 since 1950 while the 20th percentile has only grown from just under $20,000 to just over $20,000... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:United_S...n_1947-2007.svg

I've never thought of calculating it as a percentage. I always just round up. If the cab comes to £19.90 I'd hoy an extra couple of quid on like. I wouldn't leave the driver with 10p. Say your cab costs £5.20 do you rummage in your man purse for the 52p?

If they haven't coordinated a joint apology and Brown has just been shamed into this by Australia taking the lead, then perhaps he deserves some citicism on that score.... http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/ni...an_apology.html

maybe you couldnt if they were your misdeeds, however, wtf has Gordon Brown got to do with it? gesture politics of the highest order imo!! Well you edited out the point I made about apologising for deeds that weren't my fault too. Gordon Brown is the Prime Minister of the nation that swept their disadvantaged citizens under the carpet as recently as 40 years ago. Of course it's a gesture...but a valuable one. It was wrong. I had no idea it had happened and recognition of the fact it did from the highest authority will give the victims a significant level of closure. Why should their ill treatment go unobserved? How will apologising hurt us as a nation? I didnt say it would hurt us as a nation? as you say, you have no idea what happened quite simply because it was before your (and mine) time. this makes its possible to distort the facts of what happened (if it was politically advantageous to do so). completely agree it was wrong but i already knew it had happened and i dont need any 'recognition' from the highest authority to know that it was a terrible misdeed. as i said earlier, gesture politics imo. as if he has nowt better to apologise for............... If apologising does no harm, and means a great deal to the many people affected, what's your problem with it? I fail to see any humane reason to object. That woeful article doesn't priovide any either. Something being before my time is no reason I shouldn't know about it. It disgusts me that if my parents had been only slightly more poor, they could have been shipped off to be abused and used as cheap labour. completley agree, but at the risk of repeating myself, he has more up to date actions to apologise for which in all probability, affect more people. once again, distraction & gesture politics imo He's not going to apologise for his actions and those of his government while enacting them is he though. I agree he has lots of his own actions to apologise for. I don't see how this entirely warranted apology distracts us from that different subject though. Even if it does, your problem seems to be different to Philips' anyway. She seems to think the apology proves Gordo hates Britain. i'm not certain if thats meant to be tongue in cheek?? by phillips i mean, not you happy. i dont know phillips but she seems like a bit of a harridan so it wouldnt surprise me if thats what she really thinks. and youre spot on about the fact he wont apologise for his own actions when its so much easier to apologise for others and then guess what? no blame is then attached to wor Gordo! ergo. distraction politics and he (Gordo, as we seem to be calling him now) will then be able to milk the event thus proving what a fine upstanding statesman he is. ergo. gesture politics I don't see how apolgising for this removes any blame whatsoever for anything else. It comes across like you're saying he should either resolve EVERY issue currently on his desk in one fell swoop or he shouldn't bother with any, because anything he gets right is just a political manoeuvre to mask other misdeeds.

maybe you couldnt if they were your misdeeds, however, wtf has Gordon Brown got to do with it? gesture politics of the highest order imo!! Well you edited out the point I made about apologising for deeds that weren't my fault too. Gordon Brown is the Prime Minister of the nation that swept their disadvantaged citizens under the carpet as recently as 40 years ago. Of course it's a gesture...but a valuable one. It was wrong. I had no idea it had happened and recognition of the fact it did from the highest authority will give the victims a significant level of closure. Why should their ill treatment go unobserved? How will apologising hurt us as a nation? I didnt say it would hurt us as a nation? as you say, you have no idea what happened quite simply because it was before your (and mine) time. this makes its possible to distort the facts of what happened (if it was politically advantageous to do so). completely agree it was wrong but i already knew it had happened and i dont need any 'recognition' from the highest authority to know that it was a terrible misdeed. as i said earlier, gesture politics imo. as if he has nowt better to apologise for............... If apologising does no harm, and means a great deal to the many people affected, what's your problem with it? I fail to see any humane reason to object. That woeful article doesn't priovide any either. Something being before my time is no reason I shouldn't know about it. It disgusts me that if my parents had been only slightly more poor, they could have been shipped off to be abused and used as cheap labour. completley agree, but at the risk of repeating myself, he has more up to date actions to apologise for which in all probability, affect more people. once again, distraction & gesture politics imo He's not going to apologise for his actions and those of his government while enacting them is he though. I agree he has lots of his own actions to apologise for. I don't see how this entirely warranted apology distracts us from that different subject though. Even if it does, your problem seems to be different to Philips' anyway. She seems to think the apology proves Gordo hates Britain.

Maybe Melanie Phillips does spout shite, but i reckon with the Brown article she got it spot on! stop trying to distract from the truth of the article by quoting the authors previous. So you agree with her that by apologising Gordon Brown has proved himself to be ashamed of the country itself? That it amounts to treachery and he should apologise for THAT! Ridiculous. I'd be ashamed of the country if my leaders couldn't recognise we have done some shameful things in the past....it would be even better if he could recognise the shameful things we continue to do. so whats the cutoff point then? when does Gordon start apologising for pulling the wings off flies as a bairn? all i'm saying is he needs to apologise for his own misdeeds before he starts trying to distract us away from those facts by apologising for something that was instituted before he was born. distraction AND gesture politics imo There is no cut-off point. If we don't take responsinbility for past deeds we''re doomed to repeat them aren't we? I don't see how this is distracting anyone from anything either. Which story has been knocked off the front pages?

maybe you couldnt if they were your misdeeds, however, wtf has Gordon Brown got to do with it? gesture politics of the highest order imo!! Well you edited out the point I made about apologising for deeds that weren't my fault too. Gordon Brown is the Prime Minister of the nation that swept their disadvantaged citizens under the carpet as recently as 40 years ago. Of course it's a gesture...but a valuable one. It was wrong. I had no idea it had happened and recognition of the fact it did from the highest authority will give the victims a significant level of closure. Why should their ill treatment go unobserved? How will apologising hurt us as a nation? I didnt say it would hurt us as a nation? as you say, you have no idea what happened quite simply because it was before your (and mine) time. this makes its possible to distort the facts of what happened (if it was politically advantageous to do so). completely agree it was wrong but i already knew it had happened and i dont need any 'recognition' from the highest authority to know that it was a terrible misdeed. as i said earlier, gesture politics imo. as if he has nowt better to apologise for............... If apologising does no harm, and means a great deal to the many people affected, what's your problem with it? I fail to see any humane reason to object. That woeful article doesn't priovide any either. Something being before my time is no reason I shouldn't know about it. It disgusts me that if my parents had been only slightly more poor, they could have been shipped off to be abused and used as cheap labour.

Maybe Melanie Phillips does spout shite, but i reckon with the Brown article she got it spot on! stop trying to distract from the truth of the article by quoting the authors previous. So you agree with her that by apologising Gordon Brown has proved himself to be ashamed of the country itself? That it amounts to treachery and he should apologise for THAT! Ridiculous. I'd be ashamed of the country if my leaders couldn't recognise we have done some shameful things in the past....it would be even better if he could recognise the shameful things we continue to do.

maybe you couldnt if they were your misdeeds, however, wtf has Gordon Brown got to do with it? gesture politics of the highest order imo!! Well you edited out the point I made about apologising for deeds that weren't my fault too. Gordon Brown is the Prime Minister of the nation that swept their disadvantaged citizens under the carpet as recently as 40 years ago. Of course it's a gesture...but a valuable one. It was wrong. I had no idea it had happened and recognition of the fact it did from the highest authority will give the victims a significant level of closure. Why should their ill treatment go unobserved? How will apologising hurt us as a nation?

More specifically, the author of that article, Melanie Philips, talks particularly odious shite...

Of course we should apologise for past misdeeds. That sort of horseshit is Sarah Palinesque "Let us continue to love our country, be proud of our country, and never apologize". I couldn't be proud of myself if I couldn't show contrition. If my 2 year old kid causes someone a problem, I apologise on their behalf...because they're incapable of doing so and I have to take ownership of their misdeed. It takes nothing to apologise for something. Recognise it was clearly wrong and move on. The Daily Mail talk shite.

I've forgotten nothing. I was the one who started the thread to point out Brown richly deserved a slagging for decisions that have dropped us in the shit. The Sun also deserve a slagging for wholeheartedly endorsing those decisions across the board...and now visciously turning on the party so they can be on the winning team.

http://www.newstatesman.com/uk-politics/20...murdoch-kinnock

and again.... I'm doing 'God's work' - Lloyd Blankfein, Goldman’s chairman and chief executive

Hope you had a nice day and got lots of new toys.

What did you say? And did he put you down? Wasn't really a heckle as such. Canny embarrassing cos I hate piss-heads at comedy, but he was doing his Bullseye bit and having had a couple I jumped in with the "Iiiiiiiiiiiiin one" catchphrase. Must have pissed him off cos that's what he was going on to himself, but he was pleasant about it. More pleasant than he was to another heckler who he cleverly put down with the witty retort "shut up yer cunt!"

There's always a catch in the small print isn't there

Big Star - Radio City

Mars Attacks Taken me 13 years to watch this and I wasn't missing much...apart from Tom Jones petting deer and handling a hawk at the end.

SATURDAY 14TH NOVEMBER I'M A CYBORG, BUT THAT'S OK 11pm Film4 Terminator Korea style. Directed by Chan Wook Park (who we all love for Oldboy). The title suggests a sci-fi romp, but it's not, it's set in a mental institute where a young lass whose family has a history of mental disorders, is being treated for one of her own (the title should cover that). Sounds depressing, but it's all done with a sense of humour and looks as gorgeous as anything Park's done before. Absoloutley love the guy more and more with every film. I read an interview with him where he said he made this as a film his kids could enjoy. Don't worry though, within the first 5 minutes a lass has slit her wrists, wanged some live wires into her arm and blown herself across the room in a singed mess. There's much more carnage throughout too. The tone is a lot lighter than any of his previous films though, I imagine a large percentage of Oldboy fans will be disappointed with it as it's not as conventional as that. 36 QUAI DES ORFEVRES 12.15am BBC4 French cop film that won all the national awards. Currently getting a Robert De Niro remake made, watch it now so you can be all snotty about the American version when it arrives. ASHES OF TIME REDUX 1.05am Film4 Mentioned last week 　 SUNDAY 15TH NOVEMBER ZATOICHI 11.20pm Film4 Takeshi Kitano (Sonatine, Hana Bi, Takeshi's castle) film in which a blind samurai takes up residence in a small villige. There's a whole history of Zatoichi films and TV shows that I've not seen, but the film is great fun. WILD STRAWBERRIES 1.40am Film4 Probably my favourite Bergman film. An old man about to receive an award contemplates life. MONDAY 16TH NOVEMBER MEMORIES OF MATSUKO 11.15pm Film4 Never seen it. Directed by the same bloke who did Kamikaze Girls. Won some Japanese academy awards a few years back. WINTER LIGHT 1.50am Film4 Mentioned last week. 　 WEDNESDAY 18TH NOVEMBER TOKYO SONATA 10.40pm Film4 The dad of a family loses his job to cheap labour. Never seen it. Won plenty of awards including Un Certain Regard Jury Prize at Cannes. THURSDAY 19TH NOVEMBER WILD STRAWBERRIES 11am Film4 See above 　 FRIDAY 20TH NOVEMBER BLACK BOOK 10pm More4 Dutch World War 2 film directed by Paul Verhoven (Robocop, Starship Troopers).

Meeee You are speaking to the jewellery queen here You wont do any better for value and choice than QVC. Plus they offer 28 days no quibble money back guarantee....they actually encourage you to wear the jewellery for a few weeks to see if you like it. . At the moment if you order then that time is extended untill the end of Jan for returns as people buy for xmas gifts. They do sell some tacky costume jewellery but the choice goes right up to diamonds. Ive never seen such a full range of gemstones inc rarer ones anywhere else. Over the years I've bought Garnet, Aquamarine, Blueberry quartz, Morganite, Tanzanite etc etc (I could go on and on ) You just dont get that choice or price in shops. If the piece you're looking at online has been shown on the TV show then there is normally the video clip to see it close up too. Also have a look in the clearance/last clicks section as you see some real bargains there. QVC UK Cheers TR. I'll have a gander. I always thought QVC sold tat exclusively though. (Apart from them coats with a picture of a wolf on)

Fox news at it again...