Happy Face

I slept with a lass once, doesn't mean I'm not a raging hom. True of a lot of people. Don't worry Fop, some day you'll chance upon a drunken young lady passed out down an alleyway and you can finally get rid of that pesky '50 year old virgin' tag. Am I 50 or 18? Or just immortal? The problem was they allowed it for more than 10 years before that. I couldn't agree more. Lots of mistakes were made although part of living in a democracy like ours is that the boundaries of acceptable freedom of speech are tested all the time. It's also one of the good things about the UK in a way though. What was being said was always well beyond the acceptable boundaries of freedom of speech, the only difference was that it was more politically convenient to just ignore it, until it started coming home to roost. I agree btw. I think most people would have found it totally unacceptable. It wasn't just a case of political convenience though, it was way off the radar before 9/11 too. It wasn't under the radar (under the public and media's radar, maybe), for example police investigated Finsbury Park mosque several times in the 90's they were always told to back off and leave it alone, even though there was more than enough evidence to convict a lot of people spewing their bile there. Much like integrated transport policy they knew they had a problem by didn't want to deal with it because they knew it would be a political shitstorm that they'd at best gain little out of in the end and at worse lose a lot. Have you any decent links to support this then, or is this just another general dig at politicians? I find it hard to believe the security forces, or politicians, would have sat on their hands if they considered it a serious threat. 9/11 cahnged everything. There have been several investigations into that (and attempted cover ups too) - although in fairness it was probably a risky one for the police as the dispatches episode showed, but considering you didn't know about a universal flu vaccine I can see how you wouldn't know about them either. The thing that 9/11 changed was they realised that monitoring it and doing nothing about it wasn't likely to just allow the status quo to go on.... and in fact that they had a raft of new anti-terror legislation to play with. 9/11 didn't change anything. THe illegal and lie peddling invasion of Iraq did. Especially as there was a case to have a look at Afghanistan and an even stronger case to look into the Afg/Pakistan border territories. 9/11 didn't change the threat level from 'Al Queda' terrorists and fundamentalist nutters in general? I beg to differ. Didn't the invasion of Afghanistan precede the invasion of Iraq? What are you on about tbh? 9/11 was the result of the threat, not a trigger for it. 9/11 may have inspired some people in very small numbers. The greater converter of regular citizens into terrorists are things such as illegally invading Iraq (as Parky says), spending billions on non-iraqi contractors to fuck up the most basic reconstruction work in their country and leaving more people in poverty over there than ever before, while westerners live it up in the green zone. The threat wasn't known before 9/11 though was it? Not imo anyway. I'm not going to disagree with you re: Iraq, I've always been an outspoken critic, but we did invade Afghanistan first, did we not? I agreed with that invasion. Bin Laden was on America's 10 most wanted prior to 9/11. He was added in 1999. Ramzi Yousef first attacked the WTC in 1993.

I slept with a lass once, doesn't mean I'm not a raging hom. True of a lot of people. Don't worry Fop, some day you'll chance upon a drunken young lady passed out down an alleyway and you can finally get rid of that pesky '50 year old virgin' tag. Am I 50 or 18? Or just immortal? The problem was they allowed it for more than 10 years before that. I couldn't agree more. Lots of mistakes were made although part of living in a democracy like ours is that the boundaries of acceptable freedom of speech are tested all the time. It's also one of the good things about the UK in a way though. What was being said was always well beyond the acceptable boundaries of freedom of speech, the only difference was that it was more politically convenient to just ignore it, until it started coming home to roost. I agree btw. I think most people would have found it totally unacceptable. It wasn't just a case of political convenience though, it was way off the radar before 9/11 too. It wasn't under the radar (under the public and media's radar, maybe), for example police investigated Finsbury Park mosque several times in the 90's they were always told to back off and leave it alone, even though there was more than enough evidence to convict a lot of people spewing their bile there. Much like integrated transport policy they knew they had a problem by didn't want to deal with it because they knew it would be a political shitstorm that they'd at best gain little out of in the end and at worse lose a lot. Have you any decent links to support this then, or is this just another general dig at politicians? I find it hard to believe the security forces, or politicians, would have sat on their hands if they considered it a serious threat. 9/11 cahnged everything. There have been several investigations into that (and attempted cover ups too) - although in fairness it was probably a risky one for the police as the dispatches episode showed, but considering you didn't know about a universal flu vaccine I can see how you wouldn't know about them either. The thing that 9/11 changed was they realised that monitoring it and doing nothing about it wasn't likely to just allow the status quo to go on.... and in fact that they had a raft of new anti-terror legislation to play with. 9/11 didn't change anything. THe illegal and lie peddling invasion of Iraq did. Especially as there was a case to have a look at Afghanistan and an even stronger case to look into the Afg/Pakistan border territories. 9/11 didn't change the threat level from 'Al Queda' terrorists and fundamentalist nutters in general? I beg to differ. Didn't the invasion of Afghanistan precede the invasion of Iraq? What are you on about tbh? 9/11 was the result of the threat, not a trigger for it. 9/11 may have inspired some people in very small numbers. The greater converter of regular citizens into terrorists are things such as illegally invading Iraq (as Parky says), spending billions on non-iraqi contractors to fuck up the most basic reconstruction work in their country and leaving more people in poverty over there than ever before, while westerners live it up in the green zone.

Quoting Bush? Not cool Renton. Not cool.

Of course, if your being satirical you can say what you want. The Jihadist mullahs should do a podcast and hoy it on Itunes labelled as comedy.

Alan fucking Partridge or what?

It's decent, gotta put your card details in to access it though. Already got an Itunes account so that's no problem. It's taking bloody ages to gather info on my library. When I add albums do I need to gather info again?

Anyone had a whack of the Genius playlists? Worth a go?

I'd say it does. A gig in the union 99% full is invariably better than one in the Arena 40% full.

Even with the Smogs increase we still beat them. In pure numbers as well as percentage of the stadium filled. The Mackems too. http://stats.football365.com/dom/ENG/PR/attend.html Of course Spurs shame us all with their rinky dinky little tin pot stadium.

no, I'm not. I'm just saying that, its now only a matter of time, as things stand. You do see this don't you ? But even if they did, so what? those areas where they would gain power would be those with a vast majority of Muslims therefore why not have a councillor that understands them? Plus, my understanding of the Islamic party is that they promote integration rather than acting insular. Maybe they wil have more luck in getting those that currently dont attempt to fit in. what would life be like in those areas with a vast majority of muslims, for non - muslims ? An integrated, happy community ? Would it hell. They may be promoting integratation on the surface but is it working, will it work, are they really promoting it ? This is the point PP. The community may well represent the population of the country, but that ends up being a muslim community, totally intolerant of anyone else, starting off in Leicester, then Bradford, the burnley, then Luton ....... etc etc Is this desirable ? Do you think so ? If you are taking the view that its a natural process and you won't be alive when it happens, or you'll be too old to care, then fine, thats your prerogative. But thats admitting its going to happen. Personally I think a divided Britain isn't desirable at all in any shape or form. Take some of your points on board there Leazes, but just to play devil's advocate can't you equally say this about non-muslim/'white' councils? They promote it but it doesnt happen, which ultimately is as much a failing of the non-muslims as it is the muslims. But I'm guessing (without having a go at you and perhaps wrongly) you're less concerned about it as long as it remains that way round? There will be an Islamic party MP sitting in Westminster within 20 years. Soon after Labour will fragment itself to destruction as line are drawn. Apparently the UK is the only country in the non-Islamic western world that even has an Islamic political party... http://www.islamicparty.com/ Would you Adam and Eve it. Defunct since 2006. Alright man, nae need to give me the finger. I was just saying.

no, I'm not. I'm just saying that, its now only a matter of time, as things stand. You do see this don't you ? But even if they did, so what? those areas where they would gain power would be those with a vast majority of Muslims therefore why not have a councillor that understands them? Plus, my understanding of the Islamic party is that they promote integration rather than acting insular. Maybe they wil have more luck in getting those that currently dont attempt to fit in. what would life be like in those areas with a vast majority of muslims, for non - muslims ? An integrated, happy community ? Would it hell. They may be promoting integratation on the surface but is it working, will it work, are they really promoting it ? This is the point PP. The community may well represent the population of the country, but that ends up being a muslim community, totally intolerant of anyone else, starting off in Leicester, then Bradford, the burnley, then Luton ....... etc etc Is this desirable ? Do you think so ? If you are taking the view that its a natural process and you won't be alive when it happens, or you'll be too old to care, then fine, thats your prerogative. But thats admitting its going to happen. Personally I think a divided Britain isn't desirable at all in any shape or form. Take some of your points on board there Leazes, but just to play devil's advocate can't you equally say this about non-muslim/'white' councils? They promote it but it doesnt happen, which ultimately is as much a failing of the non-muslims as it is the muslims. But I'm guessing (without having a go at you and perhaps wrongly) you're less concerned about it as long as it remains that way round? There will be an Islamic party MP sitting in Westminster within 20 years. Soon after Labour will fragment itself to destruction as line are drawn. Apparently the UK is the only country in the non-Islamic western world that even has an Islamic political party... http://www.islamicparty.com/ Would you Adam and Eve it.

If only the laws hadn't been changed to make it all entirely legal.

If it was the fifties I might have known the names of some of the (many) people living within 500 yards of me.

No, but I've been to the Uffizi. La-di-fucking-dah. He visits there. Bit rich for local gangsters to have themselves painted into the birth of christ like .

Anyone watch "The Ascent of Money" on More4 last night. Interesting look at the negativity towards Jews descended from the times of Jewish money lenders. From Shylock's pound of flesh to the loan sharks of Glasgow, from the 'promises to pay' on Babylonian clay tablets to the Medici banking system, Professor Ferguson explains the origins of credit and debt and why credit networks are indispensable to any civilisation. http://www.channel4.com/history/microsites...s/episodes.html Repeated C4 Monday 24 Nov 8.00PM

Has it though? Would you really prefer to live in the 60's, 70's, 80's or 90's than the 00's? We may be on the verge of recession but quality of life for the vast majority of people in the country is fantastic compared to what it has been in the past. We're hardly turning into a third world country. Are you not mistaking quality of life with standard of living? I'd much rather be in the 60s! Rose-tinted nostalgia for a time you never knew imo. I'd imagine it was pretty grim in comparison to now. The Notting Hill race riots certainly had a better class of racist. Not your namby pamby modern BNPer.

6 M&S shirts and a pair of shoes for work. EDIT: For £50. Back of the net.

If you haven't heard, there's 20% off almost everything at M&S today only. Both instore and online It is on womenswear, menswear, lingerie, kidswear, furniture, home, beauty, wine, champagne, and 3 for 2 Christmas gifts. Check the price of wine and champagne though, as Thresher are doing 40% off... Get a 40% off wine and Champagne at booze shop Threshers by clicking and printing this voucher. This voucher is valid until 2 December 08. Although 40% off seems like a generous discount, it doesn't necessarily mean using the voucher will make it the cheapest option. As Thresher specialises in selling alcohol it'll usually cost more than the price of a similar brand in a supermarket, so compare these before rushing out with your voucher. You cannot use this voucher on the existing 3for2 offers. The voucher is not valid at branches in main land railways stations, petrol forecourts, Centre Parcs or student unions. The voucher is only valid when buying wine, Champagne and sparkling wine and excludes fortified and non-grape based wines. 30% off Gap - Click 'n' print an online voucher Get a whopping 30% off at Gap from tomorrow just by clicking and printing this voucher. Just fill in a few of your details, print out your voucher and use it in store between Wednesday 19 - Sunday 30 November 08 to get your 30% off. The vouchers valid at Gap, Gapkids, babyGap, GapBody, GapMaternity and Gap Outlet. You can also use your voucher in the Arnotts and House of Fraser concession stores. The voucher does not apply to RED branded products, leather coats and leather jackets, Junk Food T's and babyGap home products or purchases made with gift vouchers/cards. 30% off Gap - Click 'n' print an online voucher Get a whopping 30% off at Gap from tomorrow just by clicking and printing this voucher. Just fill in a few of your details, print out your voucher and use it in store between Wednesday 19 - Sunday 30 November 08 to get your 30% off. The vouchers valid at Gap, Gapkids, babyGap, GapBody, GapMaternity and Gap Outlet. You can also use your voucher in the Arnotts and House of Fraser concession stores. The voucher does not apply to RED branded products, leather coats and leather jackets, Junk Food T's and babyGap home products or purchases made with gift vouchers/cards. Finally, get your lasses christmas box... 20% off at Shudoo - Online discount code Enter the code MSE178 at the checkout on shoe website shudoo.co.uk before 30 November and you'll get 20% off everything. This website mainly deals in branded makes such as Uggs (see also our Cheapest Uggs deals note), Crocs and French Sole so if you're thinking about splashing out on an expensive pair of shoes, this code could come in very handy. Buy anything over £70 and you'll get free postage. All from http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/deals/dis...t-voucher-codes

Which is the single? I like There Was a Time.

http://www.myspace.com/gunsnroses 4 stars at rolling stone The first Guns n' Roses album of new, original songs since the first Bush administration is a great, audacious, unhinged and uncompromising hard-rock record. 3 and a half at Spin An outrageously overblown pop-metal extravaganza, Chinese Democracy feels like a perfect epitaph for all the absurdity and nonsense of the George W. Bush era -- one final blowout before Principal Obama takes our idiocy away. The music toggles between two primary modes: grinding industrial rock and keys-and-strings balladry. (Imagine Rammstein covering Wings, basically.) Yet to that blueprint Rose and his battalion of musicians (including no fewer than five guitarists) append every trick new money can buy: hip-hop beats, Middle Eastern–influenced riffs, space-cowboy atmospherics, and, of course, Rose's still-astounding vocals, often multitracked into a paranoid boys chorus. A- from AVclub I find myself impressed by how close Chinese Democracy comes to fulfilling the absurdly impossible expectation it self-generated, and I not-so-secretly wish this had been a triple album. I've maintained a decent living by making easy jokes about Axl Rose for the past ten years, but what's the final truth? The final truth is this: He makes the best songs. Who'd have thought Axl could ever pull it off?

Why on earth did you get that done? Must've been worried in case he had the rogue mackem gene given his location. For more ammo for you (though no Mackem) - it also made me do a bit of genealogy which showed I have roots 3 or 4 generations ago in Cumbria and Berwick (as well as solid Shields and Jarra) - I presume you can prove centuries in Newcastle. Stevie only has Geordie Genes. Tha specially tight around the arse.

I'm pessimistic this week. Draw.

Ironic surname for a wee fella.

I must try and watch that at some point. I like him and it's meant to be excellent. Actually knew about the bit you mention like and it's the reason you have films like 'Chinatown' I heard about it from The Big Lebowski... Anyway, it started up again this week, you've got 7 days to catch the first episode on Iplayer. http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00dygkw

I enjoyed the last episode of Schama's series on America that concentrated on immigration. How the Chinese built the railroad and that.