Exams- Anyone worried about them?

[TheInspiration 1]

Exams aren't getting easier anyway. A-levels are made easier because of the introduction of AS-levels and resits. They don't make doing well on exams any easier.

This is why you only got a C.

 

 

Although the questions are getting easier too, you get the same questions on some A Level papers now that you used to get on O Level/GCSE papers once upon a time, plus they move the % banding about.

 

It's even the same in Universities now, as grades are given out more to retain funding and placings than on impartial merit (although, of course, it's always been the case to a certain degree).

Is there any evidence the questions actually are getting easier? In all of my A-levels this year the grade boundaries generally went up by one or two marks. I now needed 40/50 I think to get a B in my English coursework which is pretty high. It was 36 recently and the questions can't be shown to be easier as they were made up by the teachers at schools and then approved by the exam boards. They can only be shown to be easier if done by lots of candidates. So if there were still more As with higher grade boundaries, maybe it's not that the exams/courseworks are getting easier and due to other factors?

 

Or maybe they are easier because we have more resources nowadays that can answer the questions?

[Guest alex]

The grades do get better every year which is a tad suspicious.

[Fop 1]

Exams aren't getting easier anyway. A-levels are made easier because of the introduction of AS-levels and resits. They don't make doing well on exams any easier.

This is why you only got a C.

 

 

Although the questions are getting easier too, you get the same questions on some A Level papers now that you used to get on O Level/GCSE papers once upon a time, plus they move the % banding about.

 

It's even the same in Universities now, as grades are given out more to retain funding and placings than on impartial merit (although, of course, it's always been the case to a certain degree).

Is there any evidence the questions actually are getting easier? In all of my A-levels this year the grade boundaries generally went up by one or two marks. I now needed 40/50 I think to get a B in my English coursework which is pretty high. It was 36 recently and the questions can't be shown to be easier as they were made up by the teachers at schools and then approved by the exam boards. They can only be shown to be easier if done by lots of candidates. So if there were still more As with higher grade boundaries, maybe it's not that the exams/courseworks are getting easier and due to other factors?

 

Or maybe they are easier because we have more resources nowadays that can answer the questions?

 

Yes, there's been comparisons of questions. It's especially obvious in subjects where basic things don't really change over the years, maths/science etc.

 

But you're right it's not just one issue, it's loads of things (changing exam structure - several massive exams at the end of 2 years is much "harder" than the current A Level system, teaching to pass, massively dropping % grading rate [some courses only need 50 to get an A now that once needed 75+, lowest I've heard of was ~37 for an A etc. etc.).

 

 

 

 

The real evidence though is the sheer continuity of it, year on year rises, it's impossible that kids are getting more intelligent year on year without fail, it's impossible that teaching is getting that much better year on year without fail (as any honest teacher will tell you), so that basically leaves grade inflation.

 

The irony is it is probably actually hurting the people taking the exams (as well as reaching silliness levels like in GCSEs were really the system needs A, A* and A** now and probably A*** soon), both in University difference and in job prospects (at the very best you're just going to get the same job with higher grades).

 

 

The wheels are beginning to fall off the wagon now though, which is why they are looking at diplomas (and A* equivalents for A Levels in the mean time), because that will buy them a good 10 years before they reach this situation again, politically.

 

Basically it's just the ass backward thinking of Government that better grades = better education. When it is better education that equals better education.

[Guest alex]

If you do fail just pop into the Wagamama at Old Eldon Square.

[DanTheMan 0]

They have got easier like, not much students can do about it though.

[TheInspiration 1]

Exams aren't getting easier anyway. A-levels are made easier because of the introduction of AS-levels and resits. They don't make doing well on exams any easier.

This is why you only got a C.

 

 

Although the questions are getting easier too, you get the same questions on some A Level papers now that you used to get on O Level/GCSE papers once upon a time, plus they move the % banding about.

 

It's even the same in Universities now, as grades are given out more to retain funding and placings than on impartial merit (although, of course, it's always been the case to a certain degree).

Is there any evidence the questions actually are getting easier? In all of my A-levels this year the grade boundaries generally went up by one or two marks. I now needed 40/50 I think to get a B in my English coursework which is pretty high. It was 36 recently and the questions can't be shown to be easier as they were made up by the teachers at schools and then approved by the exam boards. They can only be shown to be easier if done by lots of candidates. So if there were still more As with higher grade boundaries, maybe it's not that the exams/courseworks are getting easier and due to other factors?

 

Or maybe they are easier because we have more resources nowadays that can answer the questions?

 

Yes, there's been comparisons of questions. It's especially obvious in subjects where basic things don't really change over the years, maths/science etc.

 

But you're right it's not just one issue, it's loads of things (changing exam structure - several massive exams at the end of 2 years is much "harder" than the current A Level system, teaching to pass, massively dropping % grading rate [some courses only need 50 to get an A now that once needed 75+, lowest I've heard of was ~37 for an A etc. etc.).

 

 

 

 

The real evidence though is the sheer continuity of it, year on year rises, it's impossible that kids are getting more intelligent year on year without fail, it's impossible that teaching is getting that much better year on year without fail (as any honest teacher will tell you), so that basically leaves grade inflation.

 

The irony is it is probably actually hurting the people taking the exams (as well as reaching silliness levels like in GCSEs were really the system needs A, A* and A** now and probably A*** soon), both in University difference and in job prospects (at the very best you're just going to get the same job with higher grades).

 

 

The wheels are beginning to fall off the wagon now though, which is why they are looking at diplomas (and A* equivalents for A Levels in the mean time), because that will buy them a good 10 years before they reach this situation again, politically.

 

Basically it's just the ass backward thinking of Government that better grades = better education. When it is better education that equals better education.

Hmm, well not being a science student, I can't comment on whether the questions are getting easier. However I know a lot of people can work very hard on those subjects and still walk out with low grades. They are still considered "hard" subjects.

 

I just think that the more times a module is on a specific subject, the easier it will be to answer the questions because there will be more resources available. The questions themselves aren't any easier. I had a module that was used for the first time in my A-level philosophy. I did really well in all the other modules and by the looks of things I revised far more than the rest of my class but I struggled to answer it how we were expected.

[Fop 1]

Hmm, well not being a science student, I can't comment on whether the questions are getting easier. However I know a lot of people can work very hard on those subjects and still walk out with low grades. They are still considered "hard" subjects.

 

I just think that the more times a module is on a specific subject, the easier it will be to answer the questions because there will be more resources available. The questions themselves aren't any easier. I had a module that was used for the first time in my A-level philosophy. I did really well in all the other modules and by the looks of things I revised far more than the rest of my class but I struggled to answer it how we were expected.

 

That's what this discussion is always drawn into (much like many other tricky subjects), it becomes an emotional one of A student.

 

But it's absolutely not about whether a student works hard or not, it's about the system.

 

 

 

The fact is many schools are starting to offer things like the International Baccalaureate as they are a more attractive option due to UK grade inflation. Like I said GCSE is pretty much at the stage where an A** is now needed, which eventually leads to madness (or a sweeping re-fudge of the system).

 

No one benefits from grade inflation, whether students realise it or not, students are working just as hard for the same end results, but negatives for employers and further education are getting worse and worse.

 

You don't waltz into a job or University course despite getting better grades than someone might have 10 or 20 years ago, because the grades needed for that job or course have also crept up.

 

It's just a pointless race against quicksand, that gets everyone no where.

 

 

 

It's a bit like the mindless drive toward 100% University education, yes University education has a lot of significant secondary benefits, but ironically the more people you force into it, the less benefits there are across the board (and you start to get the grading for funding issues that have been so rampantly reported this year appearing), so there is no overall gain to society.

 

Like I said the secret to better education is better education, not fudging figures.

[The Fish 10667]

Don't duke the stats!

[bobbyshinton 59]

no

[peasepud 59]

If you do fail just pop into the Wagamama at Old Eldon Square.

 

plus if all else fails they're a little short staffed at the mo.

 

 

 

[The Fish 10667]

[Flair 0]

Hmm, well not being a science student, I can't comment on whether the questions are getting easier. However I know a lot of people can work very hard on those subjects and still walk out with low grades. They are still considered "hard" subjects.

 

I just think that the more times a module is on a specific subject, the easier it will be to answer the questions because there will be more resources available. The questions themselves aren't any easier. I had a module that was used for the first time in my A-level philosophy. I did really well in all the other modules and by the looks of things I revised far more than the rest of my class but I struggled to answer it how we were expected.

 

That's what this discussion is always drawn into (much like many other tricky subjects), it becomes an emotional one of A student.

 

But it's absolutely not about whether a student works hard or not, it's about the system.

 

 

 

The fact is many schools are starting to offer things like the International Baccalaureate as they are a more attractive option due to UK grade inflation. Like I said GCSE is pretty much at the stage where an A** is now needed, which eventually leads to madness (or a sweeping re-fudge of the system).

 

No one benefits from grade inflation, whether students realise it or not, students are working just as hard for the same end results, but negatives for employers and further education are getting worse and worse.

 

You don't waltz into a job or University course despite getting better grades than someone might have 10 or 20 years ago, because the grades needed for that job or course have also crept up.

 

It's just a pointless race against quicksand, that gets everyone no where.

 

 

 

It's a bit like the mindless drive toward 100% University education, yes University education has a lot of significant secondary benefits, but ironically the more people you force into it, the less benefits there are across the board (and you start to get the grading for funding issues that have been so rampantly reported this year appearing), so there is no overall gain to society.

 

Like I said the secret to better education is better education, not fudging figures.

 

29.3% in the South achieved an A grade in their A-levels whilst only 19 or 20 % received one in the North. Whether that's down to Liverpool alone, I do not know.

[TheInspiration 1]

Hmm, well not being a science student, I can't comment on whether the questions are getting easier. However I know a lot of people can work very hard on those subjects and still walk out with low grades. They are still considered "hard" subjects.

 

I just think that the more times a module is on a specific subject, the easier it will be to answer the questions because there will be more resources available. The questions themselves aren't any easier. I had a module that was used for the first time in my A-level philosophy. I did really well in all the other modules and by the looks of things I revised far more than the rest of my class but I struggled to answer it how we were expected.

 

That's what this discussion is always drawn into (much like many other tricky subjects), it becomes an emotional one of A student.

 

But it's absolutely not about whether a student works hard or not, it's about the system.

 

 

 

The fact is many schools are starting to offer things like the International Baccalaureate as they are a more attractive option due to UK grade inflation. Like I said GCSE is pretty much at the stage where an A** is now needed, which eventually leads to madness (or a sweeping re-fudge of the system).

 

No one benefits from grade inflation, whether students realise it or not, students are working just as hard for the same end results, but negatives for employers and further education are getting worse and worse.

 

You don't waltz into a job or University course despite getting better grades than someone might have 10 or 20 years ago, because the grades needed for that job or course have also crept up.

 

It's just a pointless race against quicksand, that gets everyone no where.

 

 

 

It's a bit like the mindless drive toward 100% University education, yes University education has a lot of significant secondary benefits, but ironically the more people you force into it, the less benefits there are across the board (and you start to get the grading for funding issues that have been so rampantly reported this year appearing), so there is no overall gain to society.

 

Like I said the secret to better education is better education, not fudging figures.

Have to say I'm not in favour of the A** myself because if a person only gets an A* or an A, it seems less of an achievement because there's always one grade higher. At present, an A* isn't merely the very best A grade, it's what the A grade used to be, and the A grade is what the B used to be etc, (apologies if I'm not making myself very clear) but each to his own.

 

Interestingly enough, I hear the maths grades from the year below mine (AS-level) at the school I was at were much lower this year. One of the modules lots of intelligent people who got As otherwise managed to get Es and Us. They all found it surprisingly hard (it isn't normally for those that work), but the grade boundaries still remained very high. That said, this is just an example of one school, though we are a grammar school who tends to do very well in league tables.

[Fop 1]

Have to say I'm not in favour of the A** myself because if a person only gets an A* or an A, it seems less of an achievement because there's always one grade higher. At present, an A* isn't merely the very best A grade, it's what the A grade used to be, and the A grade is what the B used to be etc, (apologies if I'm not making myself very clear) but each to his own.

 

The whole A* issue is completely daft, but it is what comes with grade inflation, as students start to pile up at the top end. Like I said it's getting to the point were an A** grade is needed at GCSE now (which is barmy, but there you go).

 

At A Level there always was an extended paper (not an A* though) for those that were likely to get A's to try and allow some differentiation at the highest levels (mostly for University selection), now many University's are starting to have their own standard tests.

 

 

Interestingly enough, I hear the maths grades from the year below mine (AS-level) at the school I was at were much lower this year. One of the modules lots of intelligent people who got As otherwise managed to get Es and Us. They all found it surprisingly hard (it isn't normally for those that work), but the grade boundaries still remained very high. That said, this is just an example of one school, though we are a grammar school who tends to do very well in league tables.

Aye, again it's the system, not particular schools or students. Lots of things can effect small numbers, but it's the yearly overall rise that is the issue.

Individual papers can be tougher etc., or they can have changed boards (where some give you certain formula and expect you to be able to use them, and others expect you to remember all formulas - clearly the 2nd option is "harder" even if they questions are of the same calibre), a particular class can just be bone idle.

 

 

But in the end it goes back to grade inflation helping no one, but the politicians once a year with their nice graphs.

[TheInspiration 1]

Have to say I'm not in favour of the A** myself because if a person only gets an A* or an A, it seems less of an achievement because there's always one grade higher. At present, an A* isn't merely the very best A grade, it's what the A grade used to be, and the A grade is what the B used to be etc, (apologies if I'm not making myself very clear) but each to his own.

 

The whole A* issue is completely daft, but it is what comes with grade inflation, as students start to pile up at the top end. Like I said it's getting to the point were an A** grade is needed at GCSE now (which is barmy, but there you go).

 

At A Level there always was an extended paper (not an A* though) for those that were likely to get A's to try and allow some differentiation at the highest levels (mostly for University selection), now many University's are starting to have their own standard tests.

 

 

Interestingly enough, I hear the maths grades from the year below mine (AS-level) at the school I was at were much lower this year. One of the modules lots of intelligent people who got As otherwise managed to get Es and Us. They all found it surprisingly hard (it isn't normally for those that work), but the grade boundaries still remained very high. That said, this is just an example of one school, though we are a grammar school who tends to do very well in league tables.

Aye, again it's the system, not particular schools or students. Lots of things can effect small numbers, but it's the yearly overall rise that is the issue.

Individual papers can be tougher etc., or they can have changed boards (where some give you certain formula and expect you to be able to use them, and others expect you to remember all formulas - clearly the 2nd option is "harder" even if they questions are of the same calibre), a particular class can just be bone idle.

 

 

But in the end it goes back to grade inflation helping no one, but the politicians once a year with their nice graphs.

Aye I don't dispute there must be some overall grade inflation, though having just finished school myself, I tend to get irritated by the "exams getting easier" arguments as they belittle the achievement of the students. Plus not being naturally too academic, I feel proud of my grades.

[Fop 1]

Have to say I'm not in favour of the A** myself because if a person only gets an A* or an A, it seems less of an achievement because there's always one grade higher. At present, an A* isn't merely the very best A grade, it's what the A grade used to be, and the A grade is what the B used to be etc, (apologies if I'm not making myself very clear) but each to his own.

 

The whole A* issue is completely daft, but it is what comes with grade inflation, as students start to pile up at the top end. Like I said it's getting to the point were an A** grade is needed at GCSE now (which is barmy, but there you go).

 

At A Level there always was an extended paper (not an A* though) for those that were likely to get A's to try and allow some differentiation at the highest levels (mostly for University selection), now many University's are starting to have their own standard tests.

 

 

Interestingly enough, I hear the maths grades from the year below mine (AS-level) at the school I was at were much lower this year. One of the modules lots of intelligent people who got As otherwise managed to get Es and Us. They all found it surprisingly hard (it isn't normally for those that work), but the grade boundaries still remained very high. That said, this is just an example of one school, though we are a grammar school who tends to do very well in league tables.

Aye, again it's the system, not particular schools or students. Lots of things can effect small numbers, but it's the yearly overall rise that is the issue.

Individual papers can be tougher etc., or they can have changed boards (where some give you certain formula and expect you to be able to use them, and others expect you to remember all formulas - clearly the 2nd option is "harder" even if they questions are of the same calibre), a particular class can just be bone idle.

 

 

But in the end it goes back to grade inflation helping no one, but the politicians once a year with their nice graphs.

Aye I don't dispute there must be some overall grade inflation, though having just finished school myself, I tend to get irritated by the "exams getting easier" arguments as they belittle the achievement of the students. Plus not being naturally too academic, I feel proud of my grades.

 

Yeah it's one of the reasons why this topic (like a lot of others) isn't grasped and dealt with, but rather dragged off an bogged down in emotional responses.

 

Really it's completely separate from the students, as (to use a not very well fitting football analogy) you can only beat what they put in front of you. But the real problem is that it doesn't benefit the students at all because grade inflation pushes up everything (it's no more helpful than not using red pens when marking).

 

It's a bit like the old chestnut of trying to deal with lower birth rates and ageing population by encouraging immigration (and wilfully ignoring that immigrants do get old too - i.e. a cheap short-term band-aid that leaves you with an even bigger long-term problem).

[Guest alex]

I have to wait for my result in the post. Seeing as though 39/46 in my school got an A* and the rest A, I am silently confident.

Just need to wait for your balls to drop now.

[Flair 0]

I have to wait for my result in the post. Seeing as though 39/46 in my school got an A* and the rest A, I am silently confident.

Just need to wait for your balls to drop now.

 

Huh?

[Jusoda Kid 1]

I have to wait for my result in the post. Seeing as though 39/46 in my school got an A* and the rest A, I am silently confident.

Just need to wait for your balls to drop now.

 

Huh?

 

 

You heard, Pee Wee!

[Tooj 17]

As if Wacky can call anyone a pee wee.

[Jusoda Kid 1]

Wind your neck in, you ornament

[luckyluke 2]

Don't duke the stats!

 

 

I browsed through a book in Waterstones the other week, it had maths O-level questions from the fifties in it. They looked fucking impossible, seemed much harder than my A-level exams. But then again, the latter were five years ago so my mathematical abilities have declined somewhat.

[Fop 1]

 

 

A** is a coming.

 

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/4494...c7fc94e4eb9.gif

[Happy Face 29]

130,000 years of evolution and we're supposed to stop getting more intelligent all of a sudden?

 

[Flair 0]

The exams are getting easier, even the thick girls going 'like' every two words, are getting C's. I am all in favour of the A** boundary. I hope they bring it in before next year because I certainly don't want to get compared to the current set of dross. Add to this, I finished the Maths higher level paper in 10minutes and had to sit around for 1hour and 50mins which is quite rediculous and the IT in 40mins which is also 2hours long.

Edited August 22, 2008 by Attain